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Old 06-12-2012, 12:37 PM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,625,215 times
Reputation: 9314

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Quote:
Originally Posted by hotair2 View Post
Actually no. Fundamentalist churches receive a lot more money from their congregation, which tends to be poorer than mainline churches. I doubt that these same fundamentalist give to the United Way. In addition, the United Way has to post how much of the money that they receive goes to administrative costs. No such requirement for churches. It would be an interesting number to see though.
You missed the entire point. Obviously churches don't give to UW. They don't need to.

But churchs are like UW. They get money from their members and distribute some of it to charity. That's exactly what UW does. And BTW, hundreds of thousands of the UW contributors are low income people. And many of them are forced to give to UW by their employer.
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Old 06-12-2012, 01:17 PM
 
2,083 posts, read 1,613,269 times
Reputation: 1406
Let's just call this thread what it is OK? "I hate religion and think taxing it will make it go away."
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Old 06-12-2012, 05:10 PM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,334,215 times
Reputation: 4798
Quote:
Originally Posted by nullgeo View Post
Whether Spain is doing a great job politically and economically hasn't much if anything to do with the topic of taxing churches in America ... which topic you can Google without including the word "Spain" and get millions of hits, all of which predate this story about the Spanish considering church taxation ... thus sort of doing away with any link to "following Spain's example" ...

btw: you'll note there is nothing in my presentation of the topic that says I am proposing such -- although admittedly now, having read more on the topic, I am getting more and more inclined to agree that wholesale 'absolution' (gotta love my puns) from taxation is maybe nuts.
What part of taxation without representation is so hard for you to understand? Maybe we can help you understand that if you tax a church then they have say in your government. Something I'm sure you'd be thrilled with.
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Old 06-12-2012, 05:15 PM
 
Location: Full time RV"er
2,404 posts, read 6,555,709 times
Reputation: 1497
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozenyo View Post
Of course they should be taxed. Just because you sell an invisible product doesn't mean your taxes should be invisible.
Most certainly they are all businesses ! if they can prove what amount they actually spend on goods for their people ( recipient's of their services , needy people ) then the rest of their donations, income, are in fact income to pay those that work for the organizations ! and should be taxed as such .
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Old 06-12-2012, 05:31 PM
 
2,729 posts, read 5,343,092 times
Reputation: 1785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fighter 1 View Post
Most certainly they are all businesses ! if they can prove what amount they actually spend on goods for their people ( recipient's of their services , needy people ) then the rest of their donations, income, are in fact income to pay those that work for the organizations ! and should be taxed as such .
The reality of that approach would be nothing but silly.

Most churches are rather small. They would/could only be taxed on net profit, and any church could EASILY end their fiscal year with no net income.

Then what do you have?
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Old 06-12-2012, 05:38 PM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,334,215 times
Reputation: 4798
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fighter 1 View Post
Most certainly they are all businesses ! if they can prove what amount they actually spend on goods for their people ( recipient's of their services , needy people ) then the rest of their donations, income, are in fact income to pay those that work for the organizations ! and should be taxed as such .
Quote:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof
Well what does that mean?
Quote:
a : a charge usually of money imposed by authority on persons or property for public purposes b : a sum levied on members of an organization to defray expenses
2
: a heavy demand
Tax - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

What's an example of a tax:
Quote:
: a tax in the form of a percentage of the taxable estate that is imposed on a property owner's right to transfer the property to others after his or her death — compare inheritance tax 1
Estate tax - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

So any person with a semi functioning brain could see that a tax is an infringement on a right. In this case the right to transfer property. If you decide to tax churches or religions (besides the obvious implications of possibly imposing taxes unfairly) then you'll be infringing on the right or freedom to express religious beliefs.

So I repeat:

Quote:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof
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Old 06-12-2012, 05:39 PM
 
7,150 posts, read 10,840,175 times
Reputation: 3806
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475 View Post
What part of taxation without representation is so hard for you to understand? Maybe we can help you understand that if you tax a church then they have say in your government. Something I'm sure you'd be thrilled with.
Well BIG guy, there's nothing in any of my posts that suggests I don't understand "taxation without representation".

As far as religion and churches go, the only thing I'd be thrilled with is if they were outlawed completely. As I wrote before, organized religion is the root of more suffering in the history of the world than all other factors combined.

As for representation, they are already represented -- albeit tacitly. Their influence is HUGE -- and hugely destructive to democracy. On top of that, they are getting a free pass. Many folks here cry about freeloading individuals but laud freeloading churches and other corporate scams.
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Old 06-12-2012, 06:09 PM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,334,215 times
Reputation: 4798
Quote:
Originally Posted by nullgeo View Post
Well BIG guy, there's nothing in any of my posts that suggests I don't understand "taxation without representation".

As far as religion and churches go, the only thing I'd be thrilled with is if they were outlawed completely. As I wrote before, organized religion is the root of more suffering in the history of the world than all other factors combined.

As for representation, they are already represented -- albeit tacitly. Their influence is HUGE -- and hugely destructive to democracy. On top of that, they are getting a free pass. Many folks here cry about freeloading individuals but laud freeloading churches and other corporate scams.
BS, humans are and if you think it's solely religion you'll have to explain the 100 million or so that were killed under the banner of atheism.

You should outlaw humans.

You can take the religion out of humans (most likely by force, *snickers*) but you can take the animal out of them.
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Old 06-12-2012, 06:41 PM
 
7,072 posts, read 9,540,485 times
Reputation: 4531
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big George View Post
The reality of that approach would be nothing but silly.

Most churches are rather small. They would/could only be taxed on net profit, and any church could EASILY end their fiscal year with no net income.

Then what do you have?

Better yet, what if a church ends the year with a financial loss? Then your tax money will be spent providing money TO the church.
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:35 PM
 
7,150 posts, read 10,840,175 times
Reputation: 3806
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475 View Post
BS, humans are and if you think it's solely religion you'll have to explain the 100 million or so that were killed under the banner of atheism.

You should outlaw humans.

You can take the religion out of humans (most likely by force, *snickers*) but you can take the animal out of them.
Heh ... I'm all for outlawing humans ...

100 million killed under the banner of atheism? Do tell? You don't mean to say that any wars have been waged to promote or defend atheism specifically, do you? I assume you merely refer to conflicts undertaken by various heathens to raid, rape, and pillage -- including, of course, the communist regimes of Stalin, etc.

Take the animal out of humans? Sure can't. Wouldn't be human if you managed. Animal isn't the problem anyway. Animals manage fine -- except homo sapiens.
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