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Do you suffer from White Guilt? If so, why? If you don't, why don't you?
The ancestors of Whites (and even some still alive today), were part of a society that committed some of the worst crimes against humanity in this country. Should Whites today feel guilty? Many say there are not responsible for what their ancestors did. However, Whites have inherited the results of that history, such as inherited wealth, access to education, lack of discrimination.
Interesting to get your opinions on this.
Absolutely not! I see no reason to be or feel guilty - none what so ever.
Without agreeing to the premise - How does inheriting the results make one responsible for the acts of others?
I did not inherit anything from the miniscule number of my ancestors that owned slaves (From my research 2 of my 4x Great Grandparents - that's 2 out 64 ancestors). From what I can tell those 2 ancestors did not commit 'atrocities' upon their slaves unless you consider an atrocity as owning a slave. On a general basis why should I feel gulity about inheriting privileges particualrly since those privileges are no longer at the expense of others? Any legal privileges that I have now are available to all peoples. Any social privileges are what they are - individuals doing what they do naturally whether black or white - and those privileges now have balcks abusing whites - the irony. Any material and legal privileges would have been there regardless of whether blacks were allowed to participate in the opprtunities to gain wealth or not - slaverly was a sick means to do so - but the actual abiltity and opportunity to gain wealth was not necessarily dependent upon slaverly. The privileges themselves are not unjust - the only privilege that was was the exculusion of a certain race to participate in those privileges. So I don't feel one ounce of guilt for having the privileges I do - in fact I am proud that we, white people, finally eneded slavery in America and allowed African Americans to enjoy the same privileges. If those privileges, in and of themselves, should warrant guilt then all African Americans should be feeling guilty for having them.
Most whites did not own a single slave and without whites slavery would not have ended. The Civil War devestated the wealth of the South and the Country - over 600,000 white deaths were a result - so if you believe in some sort Karma - you got it through that war.
Lastly, should black Americans feel gulity for any of thier African ancestors present and past atrocities? How come they are not feeling guilty over any of it?
Absolutely not! I see no reason to be or feel guilty - none what so ever.
Without agreeing to the premise - How does inheriting the results make one responsible for the acts of others?
I did not inherit anything from the miniscule number of my ancestors that owned slaves (From my research 2 of my 4x Great Grandparents - that's 2 out 64 ancestors). From what I can tell those 2 ancestors did not commit 'atrocities' upon their slaves unless you consider an atrocity as owning a slave. On a general basis why should I feel gulity about inheriting privileges particualrly since those privileges are no longer at the expense of others? Any legal privileges that I have now are available to all peoples. Any social privileges are what they are - individuals doing what they do naturally whether black or white - and those privileges now have balcks abusing whites - the irony. Any material and legal privileges would have been there regardless of whether blacks were allowed to participate in the opprtunities to gain wealth or not - slaverly was a sick means to do so - but the actual abiltity and opportunity to gain wealth was not necessarily dependent upon slaverly. The privileges themselves are not unjust - the only privilege that was was the exculusion of a certain race to participate in those privileges. So I don't feel one ounce of guilt for having the privileges I do - in fact I am proud that we, white people, finally eneded slavery in America and allowed African Americans to enjoy the same privileges. If those privileges, in and of themselves, should warrant guilt then all African Americans should be feeling guilty for having them.
Most whites did not own a single slave and without whites slavery would not have ended. The Civil War devestated the wealth of the South and the Country - over 600,000 white deaths were a result - so if you believe in some sort Karma - you got it through that war.
Lastly, should black Americans feel gulity for any of thier African ancestors present and past atrocities? How come they are not feeling guilty over any of it?
I could certainly debate this point by point, but I'll just quickly comment on your last sentence. As I have said in this thread, nobody should be guilty for anything their ancestors did. Anyway, Black Americans know nothing about our African ancestors. We don't know what their names were or even where they were from. I'll just throw out there, as other posters did, that my ancestors in Africa didn't commit any atrocities, so why would I feel guilty? The only ones I know who might have done something were those who are not from Africa.
It's a free country, they can say whatever they want but words do not equal discrimination.
It does if it fuels people to vote accordingly, even if it is against their own best interest
There you go: AA programms treat Blacks better then whites as they favor minorities over whites. Yes, worse scoring minority student will get admitted over better scoring White student. Isn't that an example of discrimination toward whites?
Why is that is this necessary in the first place? Is it perhaps that the school in question has a 98% white enrollment in the first place or perhaps that they have been discriminating all along? I guess that you don't realize if a white person goes to a Historically Black University the axe swings the other way.
So the only way not to be considered a racist is to never criticize the president because he is Black? LOL Sure, everybody who criticize the president is a racist?
Anybody to criticize any Black person must be a racist, too
Don't be dense! You know damn well some of the remarks made against the president are racially motivated. When was the last time that a policial party would go so far as to call a meeting the same night of a swearing in the pledge to go against ANYTHING that he does, even if it is their own ideal? I have no probelm with constructive critizism, but even on CD there are some vile people that swear by faux news and will condemn everything that the president does and say even if it is a known lie
Civil service (government) positions have been part of EOE for years....
And prior to that that have been and in some cases still are the biggest offenders of questionable hiring practices
No. Many whites are fed up with supporting Black welfare mothers and the extent of Black crime.
They are fed up with the fact that some of the most affluent places on earth, namely big American cities, where millions of immigrants come seeking opportunity of their lifetimes, still have big ugly and dangerous Black ghettos that look they had been airlifted straight out of Kinshasa.
You just made my point, the majority of people on welfare are whites, so what made you think that it is blacks? Why do you give a damn about black crime except to parrot what the idoits on faux say? FYI, black crime affects more blacks than it does whites. I don't see an overwhelming concern for white crimes aka white collar crimes that are committed by the banks and CEO and affect more people then the average street dealers. Please explain why black crime is feared and even labeled while crimes committed by other groups is just crime.
Americans are simply fed up with feeling guilty about the racial and social issues that are plaguing this country and finally ready to see the reality the way it is and deal with it. Talking about being out of touch here
No, white America is fed up with hearing the plight of the less fortunate uncluding their own. Since many whites like yourself don't even acknowledge that there is a probelm how can you be "fed up" with them
Talk about yourself. I have been literally all over the world. Visit sub-Saharan Africa before you open your mouth on social injustice that still happens to Blacks in America in 2012. 99% of Black Africa is a surreal nightmare that survives only because of international aid from.... predominantly white countries.
And why would the continent with the most adundant resources in the world need aid in the first place hmmmm could it be from the colonies of Great Britain, Portugal, France ect? Btw, Africa has nothing to do with the plight of Blacks in America.
And why would the continent with the most adundant resources in the world need aid in the first place hmmmm could it be from the colonies of Great Britain, Portugal, France ect? Btw, Africa has nothing to do with the plight of Blacks in America.
Colonies ended years ago.... You seem to know more, why don't you share? Or maybe you just want the aid to stop altogether?
Quote:
Originally Posted by simetime
Btw, Africa has nothing to do with the plight of Blacks in America.
Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. Looking at some developments in Black Africa you can easily similarities between the plight of Africans in America and Africa.
Last edited by angelmind; 06-28-2012 at 01:07 PM..
No, white America is fed up with hearing the plight of the less fortunate uncluding their own. Since many whites like yourself don't even acknowledge that there is a probelm how can you be "fed up" with them
Oh, I acknowledge there is a problem. Everybody knows it exist. Despite living in the richest country in the world, land of opportunity for immigrants from all continents some Americans refuse to participate and expect the government to provide for them instead.
06-28-2012, 01:01 PM
2K5Gx2km
n/a posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucario
I could certainly debate this point by point, but I'll just quickly comment on your last sentence. As I have said in this thread, nobody should be guilty for anything their ancestors did. Anyway, Black Americans know nothing about our African ancestors. We don't know what their names were or even where they were from. I'll just throw out there, as other posters did, that my ancestors in Africa didn't commit any atrocities, so why would I feel guilty? The only ones I know who might have done something were those who are not from Africa.
If no one should be guilty, for their ancestors crimes, then why should they feel guilty? If you know nothing of your African Ancestors how do you know that they did not commit any atrocities?
The main point is that it should not matter if you know or do not know anything about your ancestors because one cannot be guilty for the crimes one did not commit. And if one is not gulity then one should not feel guilt and there is no reason, material or otherwise, to feel as such.
The question about Africans feeling guilty was tongue in cheek to show the stupidity and assumptions of the OP's question particularly in light of the fact that most whites did not own a single slave and have nothing to show for it today. He specifically linked inheriting results of slavery with the guilt and/or feelings of guilt for slavery - and he has done so without any justification. It is obvious that he is arguing for some link between the two. There is none. Those who actually feel guitly (which seems to be nill according to his own poll) are not any justification for such a link since those feelings are very subjective and based upon many alternitive factors - for instance political BS.
Every immigrant group lost its cultural identity, language. No other group received a treatment like the slaves but each and every one had to give something up to fit in.
This is especially true of the early Irish brought to the colonies and the Caribbean. The early sweeps under Cromwell took thousands of Irish to ships involuntarily and into bondage in the West Indies and American colonies. One of the goals was to eliminate the culture and language as Cromwell considered all Irish to be pests. In the Caribbean, there are areas where the mixed population with a predominance of Irish names still use Galic, but for those who came further north, it was not passed on.
This was very close to African cultures being forcably left behind as the culture of Ireland at the time was very tribal and unique and in the end the one that exists now is just a small shadow of what was slowly eliminated, intentionally or not. There is and was nothign to go back to.
Last edited by nightbird47; 06-28-2012 at 01:26 PM..
And how did you think Affirmative Action works? Of course if the job / student admission / promotion is given to someone based on classification as "minority" then there is someone else who was denied this job based on the fact that he or she is not. That happens all the time and everywhere. Hopefully not for long.
First you complain about black crime and at the same time you don't want them to have fair access to college, so where exactly do you suggest they do, flip burgers and hope that there meager jobs will get them by and rely on social security when they no longer are useful to society?
AA also works for veterans, I guess if someone gets "bumped" by a veteran you would have a probelm with that as well?
Colonies ended years ago.... You seem to know more, why don't you share? Or maybe you just want the aid to stop altogether?
Much of Africa was colonized for hundreds of years by Europeans; most received independence in the 1970s. Do you really think that the continent's leaders can erase hundreds of years of damage from colonialism in less than 40 years of independence? Especially since many of the former colonies, especially the French ones, still have strong ties with the colonists.
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hmmmm could it be from the colonies of Great Britain, Portugal, France ect? Btw, Africa has nothing to do with the plight of Blacks in America.