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Old 07-17-2012, 06:22 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 17,355,865 times
Reputation: 7990

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
No. If you want to know what Democrats and Republicans think about an issue, you take a legitimate poll. You don't pick out one or two leaders and assume they represent the majority, especially when they're not even holding an elected office.



There's a big difference between liberalism on social issues and liberalism on economic issues. Most people who favor legalizing marijuana would call their position a liberal one.

I would argue that the official appointed by the titular head of the Democratic party is just as significant, if not moreso, than a poll result. If Democrats really wanted legalization why wouldn't they be demanding Kerlikowske's ouster? Why would he even have been chosen in the first place?

It's easy to get into a semantic quicksand w/ the word 'liberal.' I could be wrong but I find it hard to believe that the same folks who brought the war on tobacco are ever going to legalize pot. And again, the trend to socialized medicine makes it even tougher, because people like me will tend to drop support for legalization.
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Old 07-17-2012, 06:33 PM
 
Location: Florida
76,975 posts, read 47,611,572 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maabus1999 View Post
OP,

There are several types of Libertarian Philosophies, with most coming down to Fiscal or Social Libertarian. Maher says he is a Social Libertarian.

A full libertarian is pretty rare, as many Conservative Libertarians these days are actually mainly Fiscal Libertarians in belief.
True. As a matter of fact US is the only country where most people associate libertarians to conservatives (fiscally, and liberal socially). Everywhere else they are left-anarchists. Of course in US too, there are many kinds of libertarians, even socialist libertarians.
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Old 07-17-2012, 06:39 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 17,355,865 times
Reputation: 7990
People can call themselves anything they want, but "socialist libertarian" is like saying "dry water." Libertarians are for freedom, both personal and economic (and really the two are one in the same).
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Old 07-17-2012, 06:45 PM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,187,535 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
Please, he wants more government,.
So do Republicans. So what?

Besides, why does anyone care what he calls himself? That's his problem if he's confused.
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Old 07-17-2012, 06:53 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 37,038,764 times
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Self-claimed libertarians claiming that other self-claimed libertarians aren't real libertarians seems to be pretty ridiculous since it appears, at least to me, that the essences of being a libertarian is believing in pretty much damn near anything one wants to believe, free from any group telling you what to believe. And, since there doesn't appear to be a libertarian orthodoxy, because that would be un-libertarian, it is hard to imagine what standard one would use to determine another's libertarianism. It is akin to anarchist claiming another anarchist isn't an anarchist because they don't follow the rules of the anarchist.
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:00 PM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,684,110 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smittyjohnny38 View Post
If he's libertarian, than Im the tooth fairy. AT least Keith Olbermann admits he's liberal and not ashamed of his beliefs. I think Maher says he's Libertarian so as to appear open-minded, when in fact he himself knows he's a liberal.
Yes, I think he think he looks smarter or something if he says he's a liberatarian rather than the blind follower than he is. He absolutely worships liberal politicians, believes in ultra big government.
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:04 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis
2,526 posts, read 3,050,536 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
People can call themselves anything they want, but "socialist libertarian" is like saying "dry water." Libertarians are for freedom, both personal and economic (and really the two are one in the same).
Libertarianism is merely the opposite of authoritarianism. In and of themselves, economic theories play no role in the definition of either term. One can believe in any number of economic theories which come under the general heading of "socialism" and still be a libertarian. Likewise for many strains of capitalism.

Authoritarianism can be present regardless of economic policy. It has historically reared it's head in socialistic and capitalistic states, in relatively equal proportion.

Many socialists are avidly opposed to any kind of statism--believing that economic policies should be democratically determined by small groups of workers, without the control or presence of any state intervention. They are by definition, libertarian socialists.
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:08 PM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,684,110 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shorebaby View Post
He's trying to malign libertarians.
The only thing is -- most so-called libertarians today are just like Maher,, they love big government, spending, taxes, Obama and Clinton, they want unlimited illegal immigration, welfare handouts to anyone who doesn't want to work, and big taxes and unlimited amounts of any and all kinds of drugs made available and legal and even taxed.
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:14 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 17,355,865 times
Reputation: 7990
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogead View Post
Libertarianism is merely the opposite of authoritarianism. In and of themselves, economic theories play no role in the definition of either term. One can believe in any number of economic theories which come under the general heading of "socialism" and still be a libertarian. Likewise for many strains of capitalism.

Authoritarianism can be present regardless of economic policy. It has historically reared it's head in socialistic and capitalistic states, in relatively equal proportion.

Many socialists are avidly opposed to any kind of statism--believing that economic policies should be democratically determined by small groups of workers, without the control or presence of any state intervention. They are by definition, libertarian socialists.
Libertarianism is individualism. Where possible, libertarians want the power of decision making left in the hands of the individual rather than the collective.

A socialist 'avidly opposed to any kind of statism' would have to be one very confused fellow. The basic definition of socialism is state ownership of the means of production.
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:22 PM
 
Location: Florida
76,975 posts, read 47,611,572 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
People can call themselves anything they want, but "socialist libertarian" is like saying "dry water." Libertarians are for freedom, both personal and economic (and really the two are one in the same).
Google it. For example in Scandinavia, schools are funded by tax payer, but NOT ran by the government. So, the while the funding part is socialist, the rest is not.
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