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Here in Canada - The day I heard Obama was elected I was walking through a run down part of town..up by the city jail..I stood on the corner for a moment waiting for the lights to change. I was approached by a black male- about 40 years old..He had a mass of scars on this face..a rough looking character who also seemed drunk. This guy in the most menacing manner- put his face about two inches from mine and growled - "OBAMA" as if it were a threat...if some how the blacks had taken over and some how little old whitey me was about to pay for 200 years worth of offence and abuse....
I am sure that many black people actually thought that "one of their guys was now in control" - Not having any idea how are system works I believe that it has taken a full term in this administration for some of the black population to come to the realization that this guy is NOT out to help anyone but himself and he may as well be white. Obama has made things worse- He is the false promise that never came through..but the damage is done- few still understand that color of skin does not mean a lot when it comes to power- those in power are like those leaving a jail who promise to phone grandma on your behalf but once they are past the prison gates- all inside are forgotten.
No, actually "we" thought that this is exactly how some White people would characterize and view the election of President Obama. When White people such as yourself give anecdotal portrayals of Black people as "the villian" (as you did in your post) they are actually (and unknowingly) telling on themselves. They are afraid that Black people will now do to them what they have done to Black people for hundreds of years. Its an admission of guilt.
When President Obama was elected I knew that certain types of White people would immediately start the process of undermining him (which they did). I knew that White people would do what they always do when they "lose control" to a Black person which is they start with character assassination (Tea Party, calling him a communist, the birthers, etc) and they attempt to call the Black person incompetent (calling him worse Pres., demanding college transcripts, etc)
Any Black person who has held a mid-level management position or higher at any job (especially where there are White subordinates) or who is a professional has personally seen (or experienced) each and every one of these tactics that has been used against President Obama and then some. We've seen it ALL before. So the fact that some White folks tried to use these against President Obama is just standard operating procedure.
No, actually "we" thought that this is exactly how some White people would characterize and view the election of President Obama. When White people such as yourself give anecdotal portrayals of Black people as "the villian" (as you did in your post) they are actually (and unknowingly) telling on themselves. They are afraid that Black people will now do to them what they have done to Black people for hundreds of years. Its an admission of guilt.
When President Obama was elected I knew that certain types of White people would immediately start the process of undermining him (which they did). I knew that White people would do what they always do when they "lose control" to a Black person which is they start with character assassination (Tea Party, calling him a communist, the birthers, etc) and they attempt to call the Black person incompetent (calling him worse Pres., demanding college transcripts, etc)
Any Black person who has held a mid-level management position or higher at any job (especially where there are White subordinates) or who is a professional has personally seen (or experienced) each and every one of these tactics that has been used against President Obama and then some. We've seen it ALL before. So the fact that some White folks tried to use these against President Obama is just standard operating procedure.
Oh so what about with EVERY other president, there wasn't "character assassination"? The US loves to talk crap about the president when the president isn't part of their party. It's not just the every day citizens but the opposing party.
And don't act like some blacks didn't power trip over Obama becoming president, because there were plenty of examples. I get it, you're proud, and nothing wrong with it, but to be rude and disrespectful about it, and get in a white persons face just because, well you're just increasing racial tensions and doing more harm then good. Having a black president could have united some people more. Racists will be racist, best to give up and forget about them. But focus on the future and current population that isn't racist, and make sure we don't turn them racist.
When President Obama was elected I knew that certain types of White people would immediately start the process of undermining him (which they did). I knew that White people would do what they always do when they "lose control" to a Black person which is they start with character assassination (Tea Party, calling him a communist, the birthers, etc) and they attempt to call the Black person incompetent (calling him worse Pres., demanding college transcripts, etc).
You're blaming this on his race when actually the same thing has and will continue to occur of anyone elected President. There will always be CERTAIN TYPES who go after and undermine the president.
It has less to do with race and more to do with politics. BO being half black is a non factor compared to his socialist and divisive lack of leadership.
There is a difference between believing that Black people a "cursed people" and believing that they were sub-human. I have read statements from other Christian Churches that have described Blacks as being without a human soul. The LDS Church has never taught anything like that.
That said, I would be the first to agree with you that Brigham Young instituted a clearly racist policy. However, the statement you posted does not represent official Church doctrine, but Brigham Young's own opinion. It is a sad fact that, for many, many years, a great many LDS people shared this opinion.
However, as a later Church president, David O. McKay, stated in 1954 (24 years prior to the ban being lifted), “There is not now, and there never has been a doctrine in this Church that the Negroes are under a divine curse. There is no doctrine in the Church of any kind pertaining to the Negro. ‘We believe’ that we have a scriptural precedent for withholding the Priesthood from the Negro. It is a practice, not a doctrine, and the practice someday will be changed. And that’s all there is to it."
I don't know to what extent you, as a non-Mormon, are able to (or even care to) distinguish between doctrine and policy (or practice). We believe that "doctrine" are eternal truths revealed by God. Policies (i.e. practices), on the other hand, are determined by the Church's leadership. They are subject to change, and they can most definitely be the result of human biases -- such as racial bigotry. We have absolutely no record of any revelation given to Brigham Young pertaining to a ban against Black men holding the priesthood. We can safely assume that he, as well as the next nine men who succeeded him let himself be directed by his own opinions -- opinion, I might add, that were quite commonly held by a great many non-Mormons (not that this excuses them).
Fortunately, that kind of thinking came to a rather abrupt halt in June of 1978, when, under the direction of the twelfth President of the Church, the ban was lifted. I am old enough to remember that day very, very well, and I can tell you that it was a wonderful day here in Salt Lake City (LDS Church headquarters).
Ten years later (perhaps in comemoration of that day, though I'm not really sure), LDS Apostle Dallin H. Oaks (who is now fourth in line to someday be President of the Church) said the following:
"Some people put reason to [the ban] and they turned out to be spectacularly wrong. There is a lesson in that… “I’m referring to reasons given by General Authorities and elaborated upon by others."
There is no question but that there was a time when a great many Mormons had feelings of superiority to Blacks. In my opinion, that's nothing short of tragic. Those same feelings do not exist today, however, and -- to reiterate my original point -- there was never a time when Blacks were considered "less than human."
So you're saying the same church that today is socially conservative and against gay rights, went against popular sentiment AND religious doctrine in seeing Blacks as equal during the Civil Rights era? If today, in a much more open & friendly environment, the LDS can't rally to support equality, I'm having a hard time believing they were able to do it in the 50s, 60s, and 70s.
Quote:
Originally Posted by southernassassin
Just because the LDS Church hadnt opened its doors to blacks in the late 60's doesnt mean that Mitt Romney is a racist. NO proof has come out that he has ever done anything to any blacks in a racist way. Until then you are painting him with a broad brush.
By your rational since Obama sat in the Rev Wrights church for 20 years he must be a bigot because his Pastor holds racist/bigoted views of whites.
That's my point. The same people who swear Obama hates White people b/c of things Jeremiah Wright said (which aren't even in the same league as what LDS preached while Romney was growing up), are suddenly dumbfounded that someone would make the leap to suggest Romney is a racist, even though it's the same logic.
Everytime someone brings up Obama's "racism" b/c of Wright, I ask if they think Romney is a racist too... and that's the end of that dialogue.
That's my point. The same people who swear Obama hates White people b/c of things Jeremiah Wright said (which aren't even in the same league as what LDS preached while Romney was growing up), are suddenly aghast that someone would even suggest Romney is a racist.
Everytime someone brings up Obama's "racism" b/c of Wright, I ask if they think Romney is a racist too... and that's the end of that dialogue.
What about time frame. When did Wright say his racist remarks? Wasn't it fairly recently as opposed to what LDS preached back in the day (I say back in the day because you say when Romney was growing up). Not sure on the timeline of all this information, just asking questions.
I think the era these things happened makes a difference. Not that it makes it alright, but that is just was what socially acceptable at the time and not challenged.
You're blaming this on his race when actually the same thing has and will continue to occur of anyone elected President. There will always be CERTAIN TYPES who go after and undermine the president.
It has less to do with race and more to do with politics. BO being half black is a non factor compared to his socialist and divisive lack of leadership.
Barack Obama was attacked immediately based on his race. His wife was attacked in a manner in which I have never seen before. The GOP/Tea Party circulated emalis depicting the President as a monkey and with watermelons on the WH lawn.
The truth is that certain types of White people HATE that they have to call a Black man "Mr. President". That is a fact. And it is a bold faced lie to try to pretend that ALL White Americans are OK with having a Black man as their POTUS. When people like yourself can be honest about the motivation behind some of the backlash against President Obama then a real discussion will be had.
Oh so what about with EVERY other president, there wasn't "character assassination"? The US loves to talk crap about the president when the president isn't part of their party. It's not just the every day citizens but the opposing party.
And don't act like some blacks didn't power trip over Obama becoming president, because there were plenty of examples. I get it, you're proud, and nothing wrong with it, but to be rude and disrespectful about it, and get in a white persons face just because, well you're just increasing racial tensions and doing more harm then good. Having a black president could have united some people more. Racists will be racist, best to give up and forget about them. But focus on the future and current population that isn't racist, and make sure we don't turn them racist.
And don't act as if some Whites didn't run and join the Tea Party movement so that they could vent their bigotry in unison and "take back America" from this Black man. There were plenty of examples of White conservatives unleashing their bigotry, as well.
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In Obama era, have race relations improved?
