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Old 08-07-2012, 01:55 PM
 
Location: Del Rio, TN
39,869 posts, read 26,503,175 times
Reputation: 25769

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Quote:
Originally Posted by FairnessIsGlorious View Post
It wouldn't be provided by a person. It would be provided by a market economic system that was fair as explained in the post. What makes a market system fair is paying total income to workers since they are responsible for our total production and allocating income based on how hard you work instead of based on how much exploitation you can get away with.
And those workers would work where? If they are responsible for our "total production" they don't need factories provided by employers. They don't need products designed by engineers and designers. They don't need machine tools, also provided by the business owner. They can just go make all these products out of natural resources. Which would be mud, sticks and water without someone to show them how to make something of value from them.

Hope you can find someone that wants to pay $100k for a mud pie.

 
Old 08-07-2012, 01:56 PM
 
Location: MS
4,395 posts, read 4,911,481 times
Reputation: 1564
Quote:
Originally Posted by FairnessIsGlorious View Post
So 97% of workers should continue to get exploited and continue to have a significant portion of their income taken from them because not every worker is perfect?

If a worker does not perform the job they were hired to do, they will get fired and they will incur a financial penalty.
I thought the rich were the 1%. They are now the 3%? Will this new salary cap be in effect for professional athletes and Hollywood?
 
Old 08-07-2012, 01:58 PM
 
Location: Del Rio, TN
39,869 posts, read 26,503,175 times
Reputation: 25769
Quote:
Originally Posted by FairnessIsGlorious View Post
HOW THE $115k - $460k INCOMES WERE CALCULATED


GDP, the total price of all the goods and services we produce each year, determines how much income is available to pay out to workers. If we produce $14.5 trillion in goods and services, we obviously need to pay out $14.5 trillion in income to buy all those goods and services. So $14.5 trillion is the total amount of income we have available to pay out to all workers.


If we paid 100% of our income to workers and if we determined that paying the top performers in performance based jobs four times more is enough incentive and that doing physically or mentally difficult jobs were undesirable and that paying the people who did these jobs two times more is enough incentive and this income distribution plan was democratically approved and passed the legal test, that would enable us to pay $460,000 per year to the top 2.5% of all workers; $230,000 per year to the 12.3 million workers who do the mentally or physically difficult work of science, computers, engineering, medicine, construction, mining, and farming; and $115,000 to everyone else.

In 2010, we produced $14.5 trillion in total income:
http://www.bea.gov/iTable/iTableHtml...905=2010&906=A

And we worked a total of 222,736 million hours:
http://www.bea.gov/iTable/iTableHtml...905=2010&906=Q

Cost of Top Workers $460k is $221.15 per hour.
They make up 2.5% of the total labor.
$1.231 trillion = $221.15 * 2.5% * 222,736 million hours
.
Cost of Difficult Workers
$230k is $110.57 per hour.
They make up 9.47% of the total labor.
$2.332 trillion = $110.57 * 9.47% * 222,736 million hours
.
Cost of Minimum Wage Workers
$115k is $55.28 per hour.
They make up 88.3% of the total labor (88.3 = 100 - 2.5 - 9.47).
$10.872 trillion = $55.28 * 88.3% * 222,736 million hours
.
Total Pay
~$14.5 trillion = $10.872 trillion + $2.332 trillion + $1.231 trillion


So when you pay everyone from $115k to $460k as described in this plan, you will pay out a total income of $14.5 trillion which is equal to the $14.5 trillion in income paid out in 2010.

Why don't YOU start a business that does as you propose? It should be easy, and you'd be loved by your employees.
 
Old 08-07-2012, 02:02 PM
 
103 posts, read 64,713 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by swagger View Post
Stopped here. No reason to go on.

Explain to us, oh brilliant one, how ANYONE is wealthy when EVERYONE is wealthy.

(Stand back folks - his head might explode while trying to figure this one out).
Are you serious? lol

The dictionary definition of wealth is "a great quantity or store of money, valuable possessions, property, or other riches."

When everyone gets paid at least $115k, everyone has the ability to build "a great quantity or store of money, valuable possessions, property, or other riches" and so therefore everyone is wealthy.

Understanding the definition of an elementary school word like "wealth" shouldn't make anyone's head explode.
 
Old 08-07-2012, 02:02 PM
 
Location: Tyler, TX
23,862 posts, read 24,108,334 times
Reputation: 15135
Quote:
Originally Posted by FairnessIsGlorious View Post
Although you are guaranteed a job, you must perform or you will get fired. Getting fired will force you to get another job and you will incur a financial penalty.
Why? You could just register for school instead. We'd have a society of full-time academics that aren't really interested in learning - they're just avoiding having to work.

I'm still not sure if you're just yanking our chains here. Generally, if someone proposed something as utterly preposterous as what you wrote, I'd write it off as a joke. But you spent a hell of a lot of time on it, if that's what it is. I just can't believe that you're serious, though. It's absolutely ridiculous, but I think you're serious.

Shrug..

BTW, I think I know who your soul mate is...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2G6qJLi_K0Q
 
Old 08-07-2012, 02:04 PM
 
11,411 posts, read 7,805,058 times
Reputation: 21923
To the OP: You shouldn't cut and paste from another website without citing it. After all, it's not "FAIR" to use the fruits of another's labor.

For those interested, here's where the OP found this dandy idea.

Forum Post: SOLUTION: Raise the minimum wage to $115,000 per year | OccupyWallSt.org
 
Old 08-07-2012, 02:06 PM
 
Location: TX
867 posts, read 2,977,323 times
Reputation: 547
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNC4Me View Post
To the OP: You shouldn't cut and paste from another website without citing it. After all, it's not "FAIR" to use the fruits of another's labor.

For those interested, here's where the OP found this dandy idea.

Forum Post: SOLUTION: Raise the minimum wage to $115,000 per year | OccupyWallSt.org
It's the same dude. I told him to take those views and post it on City Data. He'll tell you.
 
Old 08-07-2012, 02:07 PM
 
78,404 posts, read 60,579,949 times
Reputation: 49687
Quote:
Originally Posted by FairnessIsGlorious View Post
I know as much about economics as anyone. Do you have any facts to back up your claim?
You'd be quadrupling the median US wage. This would cause massive inflation and devaluation of US currency....which would put all those "wealthy" people you were creating back down to a pre-inflationary wage of maybe 20-25k.

P.S. Admitting you were previously banned and yet created a new ID to return? Have you read the terms of service?
 
Old 08-07-2012, 02:07 PM
 
Location: Tyler, TX
23,862 posts, read 24,108,334 times
Reputation: 15135
Quote:
Originally Posted by FairnessIsGlorious View Post
Are you serious? lol

The dictionary definition of wealth is "a great quantity or store of money, valuable possessions, property, or other riches."

When everyone gets paid at least $115k, everyone has the ability to build "a great quantity or store of money, valuable possessions, property, or other riches" and so therefore everyone is wealthy.

Understanding the definition of an elementary school word like "wealth" shouldn't make anyone's head explode.
Yes, "understanding" is key.

"Wealth" is relative. If we're alone on a desert island, and we each have ten coconuts, we have the same quantity of resources. If we each have a million coconuts, we have the same quantity of resources. If you have ten coconuts and I have a million coconuts, then I'm wealthy in that island's resources and you're not.

Seriously - it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see why your plan is so insanely flawed, which is a good thing, because under your plan, we wouldn't have any.
 
Old 08-07-2012, 02:09 PM
 
187 posts, read 196,079 times
Reputation: 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by swagger View Post
Stopped here. No reason to go on.

Explain to us, oh brilliant one, how ANYONE is wealthy when EVERYONE is wealthy.

(Stand back folks - his head might explode while trying to figure this one out).


By your analogy a guy who can golf and all the KimyKardy baloney not to mention drop outs that figure out how to intimidate culture and social flow in whats called reasonable peace called brainwashing rap.....
gives gives zero incentive for an individual to make a good kick at the cat for contribution by education....dentist, surgeon

You guys are trying to suggest money got is fair money earned.....nice try, we know its not true. The same arguement rationally can be used for profesionals, why should we work for peanuts, forget the incentive for self advance and aquisition of a skill, I will just learn to shoot baskets or whatever, seems to get the best value for contribution.

A society cannot manufacture golfers and such that make a billion a year and also manufature billionaires ( IOW individuals by description who cannot be anything but, the greediest people ever to exist in a society) and expect things to go normal

Every nitwit on every corner in retail with their grade 8 and grannies money thinks they can soak society with wages that are no more then pocket change....u know what it costs just to run a vehicle into the slanted nose territory..( that they basically outlaw workers from living in but want their nails filed for 50 cents. Every nitwit wants to be BG...thats the deal

You got it all backwards bud.

There has been enough prosperity but its been soaked and now off shore in a safe place because the boomers don't want to pay like their parents and grand parents did into the system....lots of doe left by the frugle ancestors for difficult times and what happens to it and the prosperity...where did all the money go..? 2-3 homes, cruises, casino's, cars, boats, ....is that what they learned from their ansestors....no it is not. make hay while the sun shines not to spend it like boneheads, but because the sun does not always shine....( I'm not buying all these baloney excuse's period

Its a soak.

Is the wage for general labor a farse/ yes it is. There are countless examples in retail, industry ect.
So the small buisness somewhat not included...get the general ledger out on profit with these rip off corp....check out Wall mart and the wealth of that corp against the mickey mouse pocket change wages which just allow them to what..? stay out of jail and reep-soak society.

How many drive throughs do you go through and look at the smile...why are there teeth missing in a gainfully full time employed adult when a franchise has a year end with nothing but profit...?answer me that baby of a farce.
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