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millions of people do not believe in god.
the child of abortion doesn't not have comprehension in the womb nor will it if it is aborted.
a woman makes her choice based on values
You totally missed my point.
I agree with what you said in absolute terms. But, the argument was over people who are "pro-life" and why they make an exception for things like rape and incest. I was trying to explain my position, and why I did not believe it was inconsistent with being pro-life.
You have to keep in mind, that there are people who do believe in god. And as such, they have a moral imperative to stop others from doing immoral things, such a destroying another human life without reason(murder).
This is not as simple an issue as "there is no god, and I should be able to do anything I want with my body".
Your viewpoint tends to lack in an understanding of what humanity is and what humanity isn't.
You are trying to argue about what is human and what isn't human. To pretend that you can define what murder is and what murder isn't in your own mind.
I promise you, its always murder. But so is the death penalty. Yet, there are exemptions for the death penalty. But there needs to be good reason for it. You can't just kill somebody because you don't want to be bothered by their existence.
Interesting analogy. How come so many Pro Life folks are also Pro death penalty? After all, a life is a life.
Do all 'pro-choicers' support 'choice' in every life or social policy decision ? Even on abortion, some choicers oppose unlimited choice later in pregnancy. Neither pro-life nor choice is accurate.
I agree with what you said in absolute terms. But, the argument was over people who are "pro-life" and why they make an exception for things like rape and incest. I was trying to explain my position, and why I did not believe it was inconsistent with being pro-life.
You have to keep in mind, that there are people who do believe in god. And as such, they have a moral imperative to stop others from doing immoral things, such a destroying another human life without reason(murder).
This is not as simple an issue as "there is no god, and I should be able to do anything I want with my body".
Your viewpoint tends to lack in an understanding of what humanity is and what humanity isn't.
You are trying to argue about what is human and what isn't human. To pretend that you can define what murder is and what murder isn't in your own mind.
I promise you, its always murder. But so is the death penalty. Yet, there are exemptions for the death penalty. But there needs to be good reason for it. You can't just kill somebody because you don't want to be bothered by their existence.
I do understand lots of people believe in god. have no problem with that at all. but we do disagree not all religious people are anti choice, nor do all religious people think it is imperative to want people to live by their value. which is my point.
murder in this case is subjective. as far as justification up to a certain point that belongs to the woman alone.
I do agree with the op you are not really completely pro life if you make exceptions but it does make you compassionate and understanding that you shouldn't expect all women to lead the life you want for them
Do all 'pro-choicers' support 'choice' in every life or social policy decision ? Even on abortion, some choicers oppose unlimited choice later in pregnancy. Neither pro-life nor choice is accurate.
Aww c'mon, you can attack people's beliefs. But don't attack their self-righteousness
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sophiasmommy
No, and neither do people on oxygen masks, inhalers and iron lungs. Should we be allowed to kill them too?
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Originally Posted by hothulamaui
these people are already born and not living in a womb of another person. huge difference
Sophiasmommy was neutralizing the argument presented here:
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Originally Posted by Arus
does a 6 week old embryo have the ability to breathe on its own. Does it have the lung capacity to do so?
If this disqualifies a fetus from being a person, then it disqualifies everyone else from being a person as well.
On dependency on the womb...
How does that change the being that a fetus is? Where you get your oxygen and food does not transform you, IMO.
Aww c'mon, you can attack people's beliefs. But don't attack their self-righteousness
Sophiasmommy was neutralizing the argument presented here:
If this disqualifies a fetus from being a person, then it disqualifies everyone else from being a person as well.
On dependency on the womb: How does that change the being that a fetus is? Where you get your oxygen and food does not transform you, IMO.
being in the womb does not make the fetus any more or less then what it is. to be in a womb, to grow and develop you need to have the "permission" of the person who the womb belongs to. don't want to grow a fetus to term, you shouldn't be forced to. you wanna argue the chicken or the egg came first? in this case I will say the chicken/woman
That goes to making a decision about when life starts. I always thought it made no sense to prosecute someone who killed a pregnant woman with two felony counts of murder, since abortion is legal. Murder of Laci Peterson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
being in the womb does not make the fetus any more or less then what it is.
Right, and since there is no sudden transformation of the being that a fetus is once it's born, a baby is simply a late-term fetus that gets its oxygen and food via a different route.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hothulamaui
to be in a womb, to grow and develop you need to have the "permission" of the person who the womb belongs to.
Sooooo? To be in my house, my 2-year old son has to have my permission. I could kick him out right now (and odds are, he would not survive if I did so).
Quote:
Originally Posted by hothulamaui
don't want to grow a fetus to term, you shouldn't be forced to.
If you mean "denied assistance in that endeaver", and except for with maybe late-term abortions, I agree.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hothulamaui
you wanna argue the chicken or the egg came first?
Hehe, no I think we're wasting enough time here as it is...
Quote:
Originally Posted by hothulamaui
in this case I will say the chicken/woman
Yes, because that's the full extent of the philosophical argument
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