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First off, what does this have to do with elections?
Crutchfield can complain about regulations all he wants, but the truth is that the dive in demand for thermal coal is pretty much market driven. Thermal Coal Losses Out - Market Watch From teh artical,
Burning coal for electricity generation is a dirty and inefficient process that is being supplanted by less expensive natural gas and renewables. There will always be a need for coal in metals manufacturing, but making power within it should have been left behind in the 20th century. Hopefully those getting laid off can receive help and job training to reenter the workforce better prepared for this changing market.
You cannot replace a coal power plant with wind, solar, a methane generation plant like a landfill or compost or manure digester. Any green energy renewable is nothing but supplemental power, not baseload power. It's all unreliable, and undependable, because if the wind doesn't blow, or sun doesn't shine, then you have no electricity being created.
On those bitter cold winter nights, there is no sun and the wind dies down. Baseload or load-following power has to be able to anticipate the needs for when increased power generation is required, and reliably adjust power output to meet demands; wind and solar cannot do this.
The free market will find a solution. Isn't the free market what it's all about?
Setting standards that may not even be necessary and intended to punish one industry is anything but the free market.
I don't think you understand, these proposals will require the capture and storage of a huge volume of gas.........forever. Let that sink in for a couple of minutes.
Setting standards that may not even be necessary and intended to punish one industry is anything but the free market.
I don't think you understand, these proposals will require the capture and storage of a huge volume of gas.........forever. Let that sink in for a couple of minutes.
Yes, I understand that, but the alternative is to release it into the atmosphere. Is that better?
The point Obama was making in that video was not that coal is evil and should be eliminated from use. The point is that if it can't be made safe, something else should be used in it's place to generate electricity and cap and trade is just a vehicle to force either a change to be made or to find a solution through the free market.
To assume that it simply can't be done disregards the genius of human beings and the power of the market.
And, the right is about the free market, isn't it?
To assume that it simply can't be done disregards the genius of human beings and the power of the market.
And, the right is about the free market, isn't it?
You're assuming it has to be done.
Having said that renewables supplanting fossil fuels is inevitable, let's not drive the bus off the cliff in the meantime. If you want to argue about free markets lets keep low cost coal on the table accelerating the advancement of renewables. That's a free market principal. If you're going to make coal and if the environmentalists have their way NG very expensive so renewables can compete the incentive for making a cost competitive product evaporates, it's actually the opposite so they can keep the gravy train rolling.
Let me ask you this, if the government was subsidizing Henry Ford so everyone could afford his expensive automobiles what incentive does he have to produce the Model T?
Having said that renewables supplanting fossil fuels is inevitable, let's not drive the bus off the cliff in the meantime. If you want to argue about free markets lets keep low cost coal on the table accelerating the advancement of renewables. That's a free market principal. If you're going to make coal and if the environmentalists have their way NG very expensive so renewables can compete the incentive for making a cost competitive product evaporates, it's actually the opposite so they can keep the gravy train rolling.
Let me ask you this, if the government was subsidizing Henry Ford so everyone could afford his expensive automobiles what incentive does he have to produce the Model T?
Let me ask you a similar question: If the government is subsidizing the coal companies, what incentive do they have to clean up their emissions?
The problem with your argument is that CO2 is a hazardous emission which it is not. Will all humans be wearing a co2 scrubber around their face soon? I often wonder.
Let me ask you a similar question: If the government is subsidizing the coal companies, what incentive do they have to clean up their emissions?
The subsidy for coal is irrelevant, it is about 50 cents per MWh or 50 cents on the average monthly bill. It's irrelevant to the cost of the consumer and the irony is most of that is for R&D unlike renewables where it's for production.
If you build a wind plant you're getting something 2 cents per kWh subsidy, you can make electric with coal/NG up to this point for about 4 or 5 cents no subsidy. On top of that states mandate the power distributor has to provide X amount of electric from renewable sources so they have to buy it and they can charge more. For example that wind farm in Mass. signed a contract for 15 years, initial price was something like 22 cents a kWh or 4 to 5 times what it would cost for coal/NG. The contract also called for an increase each year that would put the cost around 30 cents by the end of the contract.
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
8,852 posts, read 10,456,964 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KUchief25
Once the EPA deemed CO2 a pollutant we all knew this madness would ensue. It is only just starting. They don't even have to mention it per say just find a evil manufacturing plant that produces whatever and show up and scream hazardous emissions and everybody just shakes their head and says yep shut em down. In reality the evil emissions could be c02 which is something we ourselves exhale every time we breath. World has gone completely insane.
The judges unanimously dismissed arguments from industry that the science of global warming was not well supported and that the agency had based its judgment on unreliable studies. “This is how science works,” they wrote. “The E.P.A. is not required to reprove the existence of the atom every time it approaches a scientific question.”
Carbon dioxide exists only as a trace gas, at a concentration of 0.039 per cent by volume, and too much can be toxic (BTW, which is the definition of a poison). Although if you disagree, just breath into a paper bag for a few minutes and then get back to us (that is if you're still conscious).
The judges unanimously dismissed arguments from industry that the science of global warming was not well supported and that the agency had based its judgment on unreliable studies. “This is how science works,” they wrote. “The E.P.A. is not required to reprove the existence of the atom every time it approaches a scientific question.”
Keep in mind an amendment to the Clean Air Act is all that is needed to strip the EPA of this power, That was actually part of the energy bill passed by the Democrats.
Quote:
Carbon dioxide exists only as a trace gas, at a concentration of 0.039 per cent by volume, and too much can be toxic (BTW, which is the definition of a poison). Although if you disagree, just breath into a paper bag for a few minutes and then get back to us (that is if you're still conscious).
It's an interesting academic topic but unrealistic. At a 4% concentration CO2 will begin to effect humans, somewhere around the 12% to 15% range it's lethal. I did some calculations on this once, to achieve a 4% level at the current rate it's increasing would require something like 25,000 years.
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