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Excellent question.
The atmosphere has changed. People are neither as friendly nor as open as they used to be. The hardcore, name-calling partisanship is, I think, troubling and an extension of 9/11 (and its after-effects). There is palpable hatred of certain whole other cultures; I won't say this is new, but the proud, boisterous spewing of this hatred is something I hadn't experienced prior to 9/11.
People complain way more now. I'm unsure if that's connected to 9/11, the economy, or just being spoiled (or a combination of all three). I also think people are far less happy.
I could feel the change in the summer of 2003 when I first came back to visit from overseas. I didn't like it then; I like it even less now.
Some people will blame the other political party. Others will blame the media. There will always be enough blame to go around.
Again, I might be suffering from nostalgia (this is not uncommon, like reverse culture shock), but that doesn't make it any more pleasant.
Do you think the country has changed since 9/11?
The notion that political vitriol is a recent phenomena is false. In fact, one could convincingly argue that we're more civil today than in the past.
The decrease in happiness (in my opinion) has to do more with the long term economic decline of the average American, starting in the late 1970's, but accelerating of late. I don't even think of 9/11 all that much these days, it's been over a decade, I think people have largely forgotten - unless they fly commercial and have to chug their Coca-Cola before going through security.
Are you saying that the terrorists have won and all the American lives that have been lost since the date you mentioned have been completely wasted? I guess we just don't have the guts to win against them and their hit and run tactics. I think that paying attention to intel about what and when things may be happening may give our military a chance to win, but you say they won on that day 11 years ago and we have been wasting lives and treasure by not just giving in to them. Do you think talking like you just did will cause you to keep your head any longer when they arrive, take over, and start chopping off heads of infidels? I sure hope people like you get to go first.
Thanks, appreciate the sentiment. You're a real joy. (Are you busy for the Super Bowl? I'm having a party and it'd be great to have a laugh-a-minute like you around.)
Meanwhile, I will enjoy my life without seeing evil, swarthy boogeymen around every corner and behind every bad thing that happens in life. I will understand that the world does not exist in only black/white, contrary to what your ilk and the terrorists believe (ironic that you have the same outlook on the world, by the way).
In addition, I will continue to understand that winning a battle of ideologies will not be done by bombs alone. I will also continue to understand that blowing up people's homes is not the best way to endear enemies to us. If you want to drop down to the level of the terrorists and blow stuff up, go right ahead. But then don't act all high and mighty as if you're somehow better than them. And don't expect to win.
I will continue to understand that I am so happy not to harbor the hate that you do.
You will now call me an idiot idealist who doesn't "understand" the "enemy". I'm fine with that. I much prefer idealists to Internet tough guys.
They have already beaten you.
And, yes, one day I might lose my head, but you've already lost your mind.
The decrease in happiness (in my opinion) has to do more with the long term economic decline of the average American, starting in the late 1970's, but accelerating of late. I don't even think of 9/11 all that much these days, it's been over a decade, I think people have largely forgotten - unless they fly commercial and have to chug their Coca-Cola before going through security.
A person can experience what they have lived through. Whether or not politics are more civil now than they used to be does not alter my experience.
I use 9/11 as a logical starting base because it happened to be ten days after I left the US for a long time. As I've already stated, I've spoken with other long-term expats who share my views on the difference between the US before and post-9/11.
It is possible, or perhaps having lived outside the country for over 10 years, you just didn't remember it quite the way it was - nostalgia, as you said.
I suppose one could say I didn't notice the changes that may (or may not) have occurred.
Maybe it's different on the east coast, out here on the west coast, I really didn't feel much of anything.
It is possible, or perhaps having lived outside the country for over 10 years, you just didn't remember it quite the way it was - nostalgia, as you said.
I suppose one could say I didn't notice the changes that may (or may not) have occurred.
Maybe it's different on the east coast, out here on the west coast, I really didn't feel much of anything.
Sure, nostalgia could definitely be a factor in my experience. However, I don't think that explains all that I'm feeling. It could be age, too. But I think they are just parts of a bigger whole.
My friend who lived abroad for a shorter amount of time (and has been back much longer) says that he agrees with my assessment, and recognizes that it seems to have happened gradually for him. He thinks my stronger view on things is caused by such a lengthy absence.
A person can experience what they have lived through. Whether or not politics are more civil now than they used to be does not alter my experience.
I use 9/11 as a logical starting base because it happened to be ten days after I left the US for a long time. As I've already stated, I've spoken with other long-term expats who share my views on the difference between the US before and post-9/11.
Regardless of you going head to head with those traditional "we're the biggest, the best and can do no wrong" crowd. Your assessment, if some would take a moment to think about it, is spot on.
These folks castigating you as though you are suggesting no security measures should have changed aren't looking at the facts.
Increasing security has absolutely nothing to do with the type of legislated paranoia your country is currently gripped in.
Statements of: Marines are used to being in danger, make my blood boil. They have not been allowed to presecute a military action to a reasonable or, satisfactory to them, conclusion in over 50 years. Waste some more of them by putting them out front in dress blues with no guns; moronic.
Your country hasn't lost the battle or war on terror because it withdrew a consulate or Embassy BUT rather because you've made the intent very clear to everyone now that you don't have any intent to protect them with deadly force! Sure, shove your Marines out on the front gate with them knowing that if a thundering hoard comes down the street towards them they'll be ordered to cut and run rather than defend your FLAG. Moronic!
You've turned yourselves inside out from the country that once valued personal liberties above all others.
They've won the war on terror already; you just weren't present at the surrender.
So taking new measures to prevent something is being overtaken with fear?
Were your parents "overtaken with fear" because they installed wall socket blocking plugs to prevent you from getting electrocuted as a toddler?
The patriot act is more akin to locking you in your room and feeding you food through a small hole because they're afraid of you breathing the wrong air rather than putting safety plugs on electrical slots.
Marines are rather used to being in mortal danger.
I'd have PREFERRED we gave the Embassy PROPER security and reaffirm our commitment.
Let the terrorists taste some Marine Corps justice if they attempted another attack.
I will agree with you 100% on that!
Are you enlisting, then? If no, then you should. it's pretty damned easy to be an internet armchair general. all full of jingo war talk, but you would think differently if it was YOUR butt out there at the consulate gates.
If you're so all hotted up to get to shootin', maybe it's your turn to wear the globe and anchor.
The wise thing to do it to give the young Libyan government a chance to handle their own threats by themselves. Al-Quida is more of a threat to them, and their government has the ability to call on NATO if they need help.
I'm not aware of having been affected by the Pariot Act... what provision is so controversial, anyway?
You probably haven't been affected by the Patriot Act...yet. It is the type of sneaky legislation that governments like to assure people is saved for only "them". Provisions such as search warrants without probable clause (which was eventually deemed unconstitutional: Part of Patriot Act ruled unconstitutional - US news - Security | NBC News) and the government being able to imprison American citizens indefinitely without trial are scary. Please read up on others: US Constitution vs. The Patriot Act
Yes, it's meant to apply to those who partake in "terror" (as already mentioned, an abstract noun), but do you trust that the government won't abuse such provisions?
I don't.
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