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How do you logically defend politicians openly basing their policy on traditional values?
Appeal to Tradition is the oldest logical fallacy in the book. Something being old does not have any inherent effect on its validity. It's just a byproduct of our tribalistic, primal evolutionary instinct, because staying in stable hunting environments was necessary to our survival when climate conditions were constant. And it happens to most effect...the same people who don't believe in Evolution.
And here's the kicker: your traditional values don't actually exist. In fact, they are very recent, progressive inventions.
Do you want to know what the real traditional family was? It depends on how far back you go. Polygamy used to be a stable tradition -- it even appears in the Old Testament. For most of Western history, girls would be arranged to marry old men when they were as young as 14 or 15 years of age. Teens having sex today is nontraditional? Give me a break; back then, they were forced to do it all the time!
So let me ask you a question:
Why do you pick and choose what traditions to follow? Why should we value the wisdom of the same people who married their daughters off at 15, opposed women's suffrage and owned black people as slaves?
PS. Interesting fact: conservative states have the highest teen pregnancy and divorce rates.
It's the left who are telling our children that they are all having so much sex that the schools need to supply a steady flow of condoms and birth control pills, and secretive abortions. and then they scoff at the conservatives who are trying to fight against that wave of propaganda to ask children to maintain traditional values.
If we have problems in society because people are having babies out of wedlock, or destroying their lives thru addiction to harmful narcotic drugs, are we supposed to reject traditional values that attempt to steer people to a civilized society? Or do we toss in the towel as you suggest and fall into debauchery and repeat the suicide of our culture and society, like the fall of the Roman and Greek empires?
Being ignorant or purposely dishonest about of the context of human history is your problem.
Before modern medicine a mere scratch or a common cold could kill a person. Families would go thru the tough winter months knowing that the odds were high that a family member or neighbor would not survive to the spring. There was a high probability that their daughters or young wives would not survive child birth, and the baby too would likely not survive to celebrate their first birthday.
It's the left who are telling our children that they are all having so much sex that the schools need to supply a steady flow of condoms and birth control pills, and secretive abortions. and then they scoff at the conservatives who are trying to fight against that wave of propaganda to ask children to maintain traditional values.
Which doesn't work, given that conservative states have the highest teen pregnancy rates. Empirical data versus your own subjective beliefs? Hmmm.
Quote:
If we have problems in society because people are having babies out of wedlock, or destroying their lives thru addiction to harmful narcotic drugs, are we supposed to reject traditional values that attempt to steer people to a civilized society? Or do we toss in the towel as you suggest and fall into debauchery and repeat the suicide of our culture and society, like the fall of the Roman and Greek empires?
Those same traditional values tell women to stay in the kitchen and blacks to stay away from whites. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Quote:
Being ignorant or purposely dishonest about of the context of human history is your problem.
Like how traditional marriage arranges 14 year old girls to be married off to 40 year old men, and are expected to obey their husbands' every word, including sexual advances?
Quote:
Before modern medicine a mere scratch or a common cold could kill a person. Families would go thru the tough winter months knowing that the odds were high that a family member or neighbor would not survive to the spring. There was a high probability that their daughters or young wives would not survive child birth, and the baby too would likely not survive to celebrate their first birthday.
Thank you for admitting that your "traditional values" are based on anachronistic conditions before modern medicine.
Why are Dems too lazy to work and support their kids?
Well if you've heard from some of them lately as i have, you would have your answers. Getting free stuff, you see is more important in life, then having pride in doing for yourself.
You see some do not understand the concept of working for a living, they want you me, and the man on the moon to support them.
They don't care about taking from others, but by golly, don't take their free stuff away or else.
What is with the Liberal obsession with Conservatives "obsessing" over traditional values? What happened to live and let live?
Because "conservative" traditional family values are laughable!? Because conservatives say they want small government, except when it comes to social values. So how about conservatives live and let live?
Which doesn't work, given that conservative states have the highest teen pregnancy rates. Empirical data versus your own subjective beliefs? Hmmm.
Empirical data tells us that people are always going to be fall back on their vices and generally be imperfect. Some people will always tend towards self destructive behavior, especially the young, and you want to toss in the towel, and lose ourselves in a moral and ethical decay? Hmmm?
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Originally Posted by Sci Fi Fan
Those same traditional values tell women to stay in the kitchen and blacks to stay away from whites. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
no, they say take the responsibility to properly raise and care for your children. If you can do that with both spouses working, fine, but don't ignore your adult obligations.
Racism has nothing to do with this, you are only using it because your arguments are weak, and you thought you could punch up your argument with it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sci Fi Fan
Like how traditional marriage arranges 14 year old girls to be married off to 40 year old men, and are expected to obey their husbands' every word, including sexual advances?
Thank you for admitting that your "traditional values" are based on anachronistic conditions before modern medicine.
Times were different. we are not living in the hard and desperate times of the 1800s any more, so stop trying to use false arguments.
Because "conservative" traditional family values are laughable!? Because conservatives say they want small government, except when it comes to social values. So how about conservatives live and let live?
We aren't the ones who decided to use the courts to force our views of gay marriage and abortion on the entire nation, we were satisfied with voters in the states deciding that matter.
How do you logically defend politicians openly basing their policy on traditional values?
Appeal to Tradition is the oldest logical fallacy in the book. Something being old does not have any inherent effect on its validity. It's just a byproduct of our tribalistic, primal evolutionary instinct, because staying in stable hunting environments was necessary to our survival when climate conditions were constant. And it happens to most effect...the same people who don't believe in Evolution.
And here's the kicker: your traditional values don't actually exist. In fact, they are very recent, progressive inventions.
Do you want to know what the real traditional family was? It depends on how far back you go. Polygamy used to be a stable tradition -- it even appears in the Old Testament. For most of Western history, girls would be arranged to marry old men when they were as young as 14 or 15 years of age. Teens having sex today is nontraditional? Give me a break; back then, they were forced to do it all the time!
So let me ask you a question:
Why do you pick and choose what traditions to follow? Why should we value the wisdom of the same people who married their daughters off at 15, opposed women's suffrage and owned black people as slaves?
PS. Interesting fact: conservative states have the highest teen pregnancy and divorce rates.
Dear friend, from 1970, I began voting democrat, and have been a lifelong democrat.
At the early age of 18, I could easily see for myself what republicans were all about, and nothing has changed, they're still the same old backward people and they always will be.
Their credo should be: do as I say, not as I do.
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