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I'll ask you: what harm does allowing gay marriage cause? How have the people of Iowa, or Vermont, or Massachusetts, etc been harmed because gay people have been able to exercise the rights conferred by civil marriage law? If you can't answer that, then you can't constitutionally ban gay people from civil marriage. (the ban-gay-marriage side in California tried to answer this question and failed miserably - that's why Prop 8 was overturned).
As to your original question, gay marriage has many purposes. For the gay couple and their families, it's a wonderful and affirming celebration of love and commitment. Encouraging gay marriages encourages the formation of healthy, committed partnerships - that's a good thing when it comes to health, happiness, lifespan, substance abuse risk reduction, productivity in the workpalce, etc - you get all the good positive things in gay marriage that you get out of straight marriage.
Gay marriage also provides a stable environment to raise children (and hundreds of thousands of gay couples in the US are raising children). Not only that, legal gay marriage provides the legal protections for children being raised by gay couples. Look at Massachusetts. Since gay marriage has been legal, adoptions of children out of foster care has gone up - these are generally older, sometimes "sicker"kids that generally harder to adopt out and often never are. Married gay couples are taking them in. That's a great thing.
When I say purpose my meaning was in asking what the necessity is? Not the possibilities it might be able to serve but rather why should it be required?
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Originally Posted by hammertime33
And it's not surprising - you actually see "gay" couples taking in orphaned and abandoned children elsewhere in the animal kingdom, bird in particular (and often it's a very good thing for the species - two men are often much better at feeding and protecting youngins.
Sorry but I just have to say... "gay marriage," its for the birds
"Unions" were what humanity entered into for most of its existence, before religion decided to get involved. (Yes, marriage predates religion).
The links provided to you clearly show that both homosexual unions AND marriages existed across cultures in the ancient world.
I didn't say anything about religion. And what you consider marriage may not be what I consider marriage, apples and oranges. See below...
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Originally Posted by TriMT7
"You will say" whatever you want to say. You will believe whatever you want to believe.
Does not make it true.
Comprende?
That is where our ability to agree to disagree comes in handy. Have you ever considered that what you've been influenced to believe is the truth... wait for it... may not be the truth? It goes both ways you know (or do you?).
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Originally Posted by kshe95girl
If you had bothered to actually read the links, you would have known that same-sex marriage HAS been performed for thousands of years, sans modern religion.
Its hard to debate with someone when they refuse to educate themselves about the history of the subject.
Read the links, I promise the gay wont rub of on you.
Sans modern religion, I like that. I'm sure ancient wheels existed sans modern wheels.
Why does everyone keep brining up religion when they reply to my posts that don't refer to religion? It seems like some people just have something to prove. And education doesn't mean understanding, let alone practical application that results in wisdom. One can be educated in a way that influences them to believe the untrue and may never see beyond that without practical discernment.
You know I'm not trying to rag on you but I am challenging you.
When I say purpose my meaning was in asking what the necessity is? Not the possibilities it might be able to serve but rather why should it be required?
To promote family. Since the homosexual family unit is just as effective as the heterosexual one.
Legal partnerships are the same thing. If you're married, you have a legal partnership. Whatever voodoo that takes place in churches, temples, etc., is irrelevant to the legal partnership.
Seriously dude, do yourself a favor and get an education.
Animals and inanimate objects cannot enter into contracts.
Call me when you attempt to sell your house to your cat and you can't figure out why the sale isn't going through!
The worrisome issue is he's mentioned before he intends on going to law school. Not sure why someone who wants to pursue law is so content with butchering the law to suit their prejudices.
I didn't say anything about religion. And what you consider marriage may not be what I consider marriage, apples and oranges. See below...
So what DO you consider a "marriage"? Usually, the distinction is between when the church got involved in the whole marriage business (actually pretty late in the game), and what marriage was originally used for (protection of the assets of the rich - poor people didn't tend to get married).
You seem to be more interested in semantics that anything else.
Marriage, unions, we have no idea what the original cultures called these institutions. We only have modern English interpretations of those ancient words and concepts.
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Originally Posted by Mylläri
That is where our ability to agree to disagree comes in handy. Have you ever considered that what you've been influenced to believe is the truth... wait for it... may not be the truth? It goes both ways you know (or do you?).
Sorry, but your belief/opinion is not only nonsensical, it's literally based on NOTHING. No evidence, no factual basis.... just your feelings and opinion on something you have no first hand knowledge of, and no way to justify without appeal to some cosmic ying/yang spiritual incense burning mumbo jumbo.
I have never eaten the candy bar, "Almond Joy." If I were to proclaim that Almond Joys are not nearly as enjoyable as Snickers, what is my opinion worth? Not a whole lot.
The worrisome issue is he's mentioned before he intends on going to law school. Not sure why someone who wants to pursue law is so content with butchering the law to suit their prejudices.
Oh God. That's horrible. Unfortunately, there are a few "faith based law schools" in existence that will welcome him with open arms.
When I say purpose my meaning was in asking what the necessity is? Not the possibilities it might be able to serve but rather why should it be required?
I don't quite follow. Marriage is a personal choice between two (or sometimes in certain traditions more) people (and perhaps extended families in some other traditions). I don't tend to think of it as either necessary or required.
I find gay marriage to be a good thing for gay couples who want to commit to one. From a social (putting the legal aspect aside for now) perspective, I don't see how this is a bad thing at all. How is it bad for a gay couple to go to their church and get married in front of their family and friends? Isn't it a good thing to encourage gay people to form committed, long term relationships? Studies show many benefits for couples who are married - overall happiness, better health, longer life, more productive, etc, etc, etc. This is true for married gay couples too.
Ask yourself this: would you rather I marry and make a home with another man that I love, or marry your daughter and trap here in a unloving marriage based on a lie (like so many gay men have been forced to do for centuries)?
From a legal perspective, gay marriage is good too. There are hundreds of thousands of kids being raised by gay couples in the US. I think it's a very good thing that those families - and those kids - be protected the aspects of civil marriage law the relate to child rearing (especially those for when there is a divorce). I can point you to some truly tragic cases where lack of this legal structure has just been devastating.
Then there's the "selfish" aspects of equal legal rights under civil marriage law for gay couples. I've lost my best friend - and the US has lost a brilliant research scientist (MD/PhD) and taxpayer - overseas to marriage law discrimination. Ben, my college roommate, is gay, and while on his Fulbright scholarship year abroad fell in love and got married to another man. Since he's gay though, he can't get Lukas a spousal green card - something that would be automatic for a straight married couple. He's instead decided to stay in the Czech Republic so they can live together as a family. I view this as a bad thing for me, Ben, and our country.
Do you remember the horrible case a few months back where some white teenagers went out and killed a black man with their truck just because he was black? The man they killed - James Craig Anderson - also happened to be gay. He was "married" to a man for 20 years, the two of them even raising a daughter together. Had Anderson been straight, his widow could sue the murders for wrongful death, but since he was gay his surviving partner cannot because under the law he's not legally family. I think that's disgusting. Why should straight people get that right but gays not?
Imagine I married a man (even legally in a state like Iowa) who was in the military and the two of us were raising my biological children. Since we're gay, his husband (me) and his kids would not be allowed to live in base family housing, my husband would not get increased family pay, and I wouldn't be allowed to shop at the base commissary, px, etc. I think that's disgusting. Why should straight people get that right but gays not?
Quote:
Sorry but I just have to say... "gay marriage," its for the birds
The worrisome issue is he's mentioned before he intends on going to law school. Not sure why someone who wants to pursue law is so content with butchering the law to suit their prejudices.
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