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Old 10-27-2012, 10:07 PM
 
25,783 posts, read 16,411,983 times
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I'm a Catholic. Was born a Catholic. I'm also a Democrat and always will be. I got a letter from my Bishop telling me that voting no on the gay marriage amendment will put my soul in danger. It also stated that voting for candidates that support evil ideas like abortion and gay marriage also puts my soul in danger.

Are there any other Catholic Democrats struggling with this out there? In all my years, I have never had it spelled out so clearly by the church as this letter.

 
Old 10-27-2012, 10:11 PM
 
15,706 posts, read 11,731,655 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PullMyFinger View Post
I'm a Catholic. Was born a Catholic. I'm also a Democrat and always will be. I got a letter from my Bishop telling me that voting no on the gay marriage amendment will put my soul in danger. It also stated that voting for candidates that support evil ideas like abortion and gay marriage also puts my soul in danger.

Are there any other Catholic Democrats struggling with this out there? In all my years, I have never had it spelled out so clearly by the church as this letter.
You should report that Bishop. He's breaking the law by influencing politics as a tax exempt organization.

[MOD CUT/off topic]

Supporting gays will not put your soul in danger, in fact it might help it. Showing compassion and love for God's children, especially those hated and outcasted by society is very inline with God's teachings. Condemning gays and trying to destroy their lives, is not and will lead to God's judgement.

Last edited by Ibginnie; 10-27-2012 at 10:23 PM..
 
Old 10-27-2012, 10:11 PM
 
23,655 posts, read 17,450,115 times
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Go to www.ewtn.com or www.catholic.com to learn more.

Yes there are definitely non-negotiables when voting. Gay marriage & abortion are non-negotiables. Vote for the person who will do the least harm when it comes to these two issues.

We must support life from the beginning of conception until natural death and also support the family like God created it. One man and one woman.
 
Old 10-27-2012, 10:14 PM
 
23,655 posts, read 17,450,115 times
Reputation: 7471
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiyero View Post
You should report that Bishop. He's breaking the law by influencing politics as a tax exempt organization.
[MOD CUT/off topic]
Supporting gays will not put your soul in danger, in fact it might help it. Showing compassion and love for God's children, especially those hated and outcasted by society is very inline with God's teachings. Condemning gays and trying to destroy their lives, is not and will lead to God's judgement.

As Catholics we must respect all people and that includes gays but we don't have to support what they do.

Last edited by janelle144; 10-27-2012 at 10:32 PM.. Reason: reply to deleted content
 
Old 10-27-2012, 10:16 PM
 
25,783 posts, read 16,411,983 times
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Here's the letter.

OFFICE OF THE BISHOP
October 24, 2012
Dear Brothers and Sisters in Christ,
AN IMPORTANT MOMENT
It is almost time to vote and to make our choices for president and other political offices both local and national.
You have often heard it said that this is a turning point in our country’s history and I could not agree more.
The Church is not a political organism, but as you hopefully have learned in the US Bishops Faithful
Citizenship material (which we have made widely available to you in the parishes, in the Compass and on-line),
the Church has the responsibility to speak out regarding moral issues, especially on those issues that impact the
“common good” and the “dignity of the human person.”
I would like to review some of the principles to keep in mind as you approach the voting booth to complete
your ballot. The first is the set of non-negotiables. These are areas that are “intrinsically evil” and cannot be
supported by anyone who is a believer in God or the common good or the dignity of the human person.
They are:
1. abortion
2. euthanasia
3. embryonic stem cell research
4. human cloning
5. homosexual “marriage”
These are intrinsically evil. “A well-formed Christian conscience does not permit one to vote for a political
program that contradicts fundamental contents of faith and morals.” Intrinsically evil actions are those which
have an evil object. In other words, an act is evil by its very nature and to choose an action of this type puts one
in grave moral danger.
But what does this have to do with the election? Some candidates and one party have even chosen some of
these as their party’s or their personal political platform. To vote for someone in favor of these positions means
that you could be morally “complicit” with these choices which are intrinsically evil. This could put your own
soul in jeopardy.
Page 2
The other position to keep in mind is the protection of religious liberty. The recent aggressive moves by the
government to impose the HHS mandate, especially the move to redefine religion so that religion is confined
more and more to the four walls of the Church, is a dangerous precedent. This will certainly hurt the many
health care services to the poor given by our Catholic hospitals. Our Catholic hospitals in the Diocese give
millions of dollars per year in donated services to the poor. In the new plan, only Catholic people can be treated
by Catholic institutions.
It has never been our mission to be exclusive of those who are not of our faith. This mandate also places
Catholic business owners in a very precarious position in that they, too, will have to pay for those medical
“services” which violate Catholic teaching. This has never been the American way and now these moves and
others by the present government, will significantly alter and marginalize the role of religious institutions in our
society.
These positions are indicators of a broader societal disposition to remove God from the public square and from
any relation to society whatever. It is precisely religion and the free exercise thereof which has made this
country great in the past.
Many people in our Diocese are presently without work. Our Catholic Charities is serving more and more
people who are unemployed or under employed and can barely keep up with the demands. Work is so critical
to the family and to the sense of human dignity. An economy which does the most for the common good is an
economy that works and provides people gainful employment for the country’s citizens. A government that
works pays its bills and models for citizens what it means to be responsible and contributive.
Let us pray for the electorate and let’s take action, that we may vote for good and moral leaders for this great
country which will only remain great, if she continues to be and to do the good.
Sincerely yours in Christ,
 
Old 10-27-2012, 10:17 PM
 
Location: Saudi Arabia
376 posts, read 650,771 times
Reputation: 226
Default There traditionally is a strng link between Dem & Catholics but Dems Policies often at odds w/Church

Quote:
Originally Posted by PullMyFinger View Post
I'm a Catholic. Was born a Catholic. I'm also a Democrat and always will be. I got a letter from my Bishop telling me that voting no on the gay marriage amendment will put my soul in danger. It also stated that voting for candidates that support evil ideas like abortion and gay marriage also puts my soul in danger.

Are there any other Catholic Democrats struggling with this out there? In all my years, I have never had it spelled out so clearly by the church as this letter.
Catholics have traditionally been more Democrats but that has been shifting as many of the policies of the Dems such as support for Abortion contradict the most important teachings of the Church to protect Life. I'm catholic and used to vote mostly Dem but have shifted to voting mostly Republican primarily because a philosophy that says it's okay to kill little babies I just cannot support.

As for your Bishop statement that your soul could be in danger, wow, that's a strong statement. I hope that's not right as we all have done and said things that contradict the Chruch. Best wishes!
 
Old 10-27-2012, 10:19 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles County, CA
29,095 posts, read 25,933,225 times
Reputation: 6128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiyero View Post
You should report that Bishop. He's breaking the law by influencing politics as a tax exempt organization.

As for your struggle, I realize Catholicism is important to you, but as an organization who harbors and protects child molesters, they really need to start following Jesus' teachings and remove the log from their eye before commenting on the speck in another's.

Supporting gays will not put your soul in danger, in fact it might help it. Showing compassion and love for God's children, especially those hated and outcasted by society is very inline with God's teachings. Condemning gays and trying to destroy their lives, is not and will lead to God's judgement.
I don't know of anybody who "condemns gays and (tries) to destroy their lives". What you mistake for condemnation is simple discernment that their lifestyle is wrong - and from a Christian point of view it is considered to be sin. Jesus told the woman who was to be stoned to "go and sin no more". There are many passages in the Epistles which teach people to correct their brother in love and to not allow sin to go unchecked. I would list them - but then someone would tell me to "take it to the religion forum" - as if this isn't a thread based on faith practices.

Condemnation is reserved for the Lord. Calling sin, sin does not = condemnation. One would not be acting in love if they did not identify something as sin - as the wages of sin are death - according to Scripture.

Jesus died on the cross for the forgiveness of sins, and was ressurected on the third day following His death - those who believe in Him shall have eternal life, again according to the Christian scrptures. Another verse says that "there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ".

So I have to conclude that your use of the word "condemn" is just hyperbole intended to shut down debate.

As someone who claims to follow the teachings of Jesus - you sure find it convenient to pick and choose how exactly to follow - and your dishonesty displayed when you mischaracterize others positions is certainly not very Christ-like.

Me thinks that you are confused.

Last edited by Harrier; 10-27-2012 at 10:31 PM..
 
Old 10-27-2012, 10:22 PM
 
Location: Phoenix
2,075 posts, read 2,132,323 times
Reputation: 947
[quote=PullMyFinger;26697598]I'm a Catholic. Was born a Catholic. I'm also a Democrat and always will be. I got a letter from my Bishop telling me that voting no on the gay marriage amendment will put my soul in danger. It also stated that voting for candidates that support evil ideas like abortion and gay marriage also puts my soul in danger.


It's called "Cannon law" and as a Roman Catholic Preist they are bound by it. Same set of rules that state
the church can't turn away the poor. provide contraceptives, ect. ect.

When Obama came out with Gay Marriage ( and the free birth control) he ran afoul of the church. Catholic
simply means "Church" in Hebrew. You can't get around tradition that easily
 
Old 10-27-2012, 10:24 PM
 
15,706 posts, read 11,731,655 times
Reputation: 7019
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjwebbster View Post
When Obama came out with Gay Marriage ( and the free birth control) he ran afoul of the church. Catholic
simply means "Church" in Hebrew. You can't get around tradition that easily
The word "Catholic" comes from Latin and Greek not Hebrew, and does not mean Church, it means "universal".
 
Old 10-27-2012, 10:27 PM
 
Location: NC
9,984 posts, read 10,365,663 times
Reputation: 3086
^^^
This

First off Catholic comes from Greek and it means universal. Secondly the way it was explained to me by Catholics, Catholics also have a Social teaching that is at odds with screwing the poor (a point that the bishop curiously fails to mention in his tyrade). I think that bishop is probably hyper partisan from the sounds of it, not that it matters since you have to really go out on a limb ala the Christian Coalition to have any consequences.
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