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Why do you continue with this? Disapproving of abortion except for when the woman's life is in danger is not a wrong stance to take. There would be two lives at stake then so a choice has to be made. I choose the mother as what good is an infant being born without it's mother? You're just back peddling now and yes you did claim that I "always" disapprove of abortion no matter what! So yes that was a lie! You did and are still personally attacking me.
Being pro-abortion is wanting the murder of unborn babies legalized. How else do you define it? You're going off topic now with your silly analogies. Welcome to my ignore list.
I'm continuing this because your mentality is destructive and I'd like you to change your mind. No...dissaproving of abortion of abortion except when the woman's life is in danger is a very, very bad thing. You're not thinking clearly.
Your moral code implies that, in the trolley experiment, you would have the trolley run over 3 people, rather than 1, because you don't want to push the lever. In other words...you are paying attention to no contexts, basically, except for your silly rules. You're ignoring the fact that the death of the fetus results in no disadvantages for anyone if done early enough.
That's what I meant. That's not a personal attack. That's a valuable teaching method and critique of your moral code. I did phrase it less poorly than I could have...but you're just splitting hairs if you think almost all abortion is murder....and you've referred to abortion in general as murder multiple times. You're being unreasonable if you expect people to pay such close attention to every little subtly different opinion you have.
I'm not apologizing for anything. I admit that I didn't know (or care) that you were fine with some abortion. I figure that's your fault for calling abortion in general murder. If you call everything in category X murder...you should probably expect people to assume you think everything in category X is murder.
Abortion, just like fetal homicide, ends a life. The outcome for the fetus is the same in both, and both are involuntary from the fetus's perspective. It makes no sense that one is murder but somehow some people pretend the other isn't. That's intellectually dishonest not to mention unethical.
You know what else is alive? Semen. Think of all the countless murders that results in
You are being intellectually dishonest. Yes...abortion is involuntary from the fetus's perspective. So is living. That second part is important too.
That's what I think. Abortion, just like child support and welfare, is a privilege not a right.
No...it's a right in the same sense that not having slavery is a right because if it's not a right we're pointlessly screwing an entire group of people...them being women in general.
Fathers are not held responsible for the cost of pregnancy and birth.
A fetus is not a child.
You have a say in a child. Of course you pay child support if you dont directly support your child.
I agree with the first part.
I'm not saying the second part, this:
You have a say in a child. Of course you pay child support if you dont directly support your child.
is not a bad idea...only that there's another way of looking at things.
Imagine a guy and a girl have intercourse and they've both expressed the view that they want it to just be a one time thing...and the girl gets pregnant.
Now, if she doesn't want the kid she has the option of getting an abortion, and he has no more responsibilities in that area. If the guy doesn't want the kid...that's too bad for him. He's got to pay child support anyway.
I think both ways are rather sensible...either having some kind of contract the male parent can agree to in which he gives up all rights as a parent but doesn't have to pay child support...or just keeping things as they are now...which also makes sense because you could make the argument that child support exists to make sure the child has enough support.
Failure to obey a court order is called contempt of court. If you owe unpaid child support, the other parent can ask for a hearing before a judge and ask that you be held in contempt of court. You must be served with a document ordering you to attend the hearing, and then must attend and explain why you haven’t paid the support you owe. If you don’t attend, the court can issue a warrant for your arrest.
Please show data for fathers who follow the law to appear in court because they can't pay and are subsequently sentenced for that reason alone.
You know what else is alive? Semen. Think of all the countless murders that results in
The bacteria in human solid waste is alive, too. Now do you get how ridiculous you sound?
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You are being intellectually dishonest. Yes...abortion is involuntary from the fetus's perspective. So is living. That second part is important too.
Not at all. The same exact standard can apply to anyone, and as 2mares has pointed out, there are many people who are net drains on society, using up society's resources (almost always funded by taxpayers) while contributing little to nothing, and are therefore inconvenient. Should they be killed to save society the trouble and costs of having to deal with them, as 2mares' post implies?
The crux of pro-abortioners' intellectual dishonesty and lack of ethics is that they want to have it both ways: Killing a fetus is OK AND killing a fetus is homicide. Both are killing. Both cannot be true, ethically.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clintone
No...it's a right in the same sense that not having slavery is a right because if it's not a right we're pointlessly screwing an entire group of people...them being women in general.
Well, I think that the women ought to be held to account for some of the screwing that's been done.
No...it's a right in the same sense that not having slavery is a right because if it's not a right we're pointlessly screwing an entire group of people...them being women in general.
That's also total BS. 55% of all US 1040 filers are federal income tax slaves for part of every year while 45% of all US 1040 filers are not (they pay no federal income tax whatsoever). Taking the fruits of one's labors while not taking the same from others absolutely is condemning just some but not all to slavery.
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