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I still have a hard time believing that WP is not a troll. I mean, theres no way a person could still hold such antiquated views in this day and age.
OP made a thoughtful post, asking some deep questions, and all we get in response is a) quibbling over minor, ancillary points in an effort to sidetrack; b)gratuitious name-calling posts like the one above, offering zero facts, zero logic, zero point.
Mathguy posted in the thread about the woman who scared off a flasher w/ her pistol:
In response to OP, undoubtedly you are right that the GOP needs a new vision, but I don't know of anyone out there who has the answer of what that vision might be. George Bush's 'compassionate conservatism' was an effort to answer, but it ended up as just Democrat-lite, a bridge to nowhere.
We just lost one election. I'm not sure it's time to re-tool from the ground up. Did the Democrats re-tool from the ground up after 2010? Not really...they kept Obama, Pelosi, and Reid, the same team, and the same vision. They just went to work and came up with new tactics, like the 'war on women' idea, better GOTV, etc.
I believe there will be better days ahead for conservatism. Look at our 'farm team' vs. what the Dem's have. We have Marco Rubio, Bobby Jindal, Susana Martinez, Nikki Haley, Rand Paul, Paul Ryan and others. They have Elizabeth Warren and Andrew Cuomo. A news story yesterday in my local paper had Joe Biden at the top of the list for 2016 Dem hopefuls.
Democrats right now are enjoying their victory toasts, but the morning will come when they wake up and realize we still have 8% unemployment, 15% U6 unemployment, $16 trillion debt, 5% decline in household income, etc.
The GOP's vision of the Good Life can be summed up thusly: a society of personal responsibility, upward mobility, economic independence, economic opportunity, and freedom to "make it" (i.e., get rich, famous, or powerful) without government interference.
Obviously that's a simplified version, but it's the message that the electorate receives. Is there anything wrong with it?
There's nothing wrong with the concepts by themselves, but taken alone they are ice cold and lacking humanity. It's a vision based on radical individualism. It's a vision that truly leaves out large swaths of the population who are not motivated by high economic achievement or upward social mobility. The GOP's not-so-subtle message is that only "taxpayers" and net economic producers are worthy citizens. Humble employment is degrading in this view, unless it's a stepping stone to "success". Note how conservative personalities commonly denigrate "burger flippers" and "useless degrees" because of their low economic value. This is a vision in which the interdependence of family and community life can only be crudely and unnaturally tacked on.
Let's talk about the women's vote. I've witnessed my wife giving birth five out of six times. Like many women, she's intelligent and hard working and capable of being an economic powerhouse. But nothing illuminates the natural and total dependence of women like pregnancy, childbirth, and being the mother of an infant. Dependence is built into female biology and the female psyche. Every woman intuitively knows - even if her feminist indoctrination doesn't let her admit it - that she is a dependent creature.
In light of this reality, the GOP has made a double mistake. First, exalting radical individualism is an anthropological error across the board. But it is less repulsive to men than it is to women. Men can permit themselves the fantasy without their biology interfering. Second, by embracing feminism and insisting that women and men share the same values - yes, the GOP has embraced feminism in almost every respect: recall the embarrassing parade of women and feminist lip service at the convention? - the GOP is asking women, who have an irrepressible and intuitive knowledge of human interdependence, to adopt a social and economic philosophy that is totally contrary to their nature.
Of course we lost the women's vote! And we lost the vote of millions of honest, hard-working, ordinary men for whom "upward mobility" is just not a priority, and for whom getting rich is either unattainable or uninspiring. They want to take care of their families and serve their communities, not claw their way to the top of the economic ladder. The GOP needs a new vision of the Good Life.
The problem is those are just talking points. They don't mean anything to anyone.
Incomes have been stagnating for decades. What do conservatives say about this issue? Nothing.
Health care costs have been increasing for a long time. More and more Americans are without insurance.
What do conservative say about this issue? Nothing.
The cost of college has been in increasing for a long time. While the importance of getting a college education has increased as well.
What do conservatives say about this issue? Nothing.
There is ample statistical evidence that black Americans with the same job qualifications as white Americans have higher rates of unemployment and when they are employed make less money.
What do conservatives say about this issue? Nothing.
The 401k ownership of retirement hasn't worked for the majority of workers and is a horrible as a replacement for pensions. This puts millions of workers and their families in a potential bind when these workers get older and can no longer work.
What do conservative say about this issue? Nothing.
This is the problem for conservatives. They aren't addressing real issues. Instead they talk about the "nature" of women and spout nonsense about liberty and personal responsibility that they don't even believe and that has no impact on anyone's life.
Conservatives don't believe in a radical individualism. They don't hate big government. All of those talking points are to justify, their hatred of what they perceive to be government benefits going to groups of Americans they don't like. That is all there is to those talking points.
yes. repubs need to really step back and look what the dems have done, they've bought a huge voting block by give aways,,,,and repubs are touting self-reliance??
if almost half the country are on welfare and the other half is paying for them....and ironically, demeanized for it, then we have a problem..
lets face it, obama won, and America lost
everyday we are hearing more and more lay-offs, unemployment...again ironically only after the election,,,but then again,,,who cares, as long as the welfare checks keep coming in the mail
The GOP's vision of the Good Life can be summed up thusly: a society of personal responsibility, upward mobility, economic independence, economic opportunity, and freedom to "make it" (i.e., get rich, famous, or powerful) without government interference.
Obviously that's a simplified version, but it's the message that the electorate receives. Is there anything wrong with it?
There's nothing wrong with the concepts by themselves, but taken alone they are ice cold and lacking humanity. It's a vision based on radical individualism. It's a vision that truly leaves out large swaths of the population who are not motivated by high economic achievement or upward social mobility. The GOP's not-so-subtle message is that only "taxpayers" and net economic producers are worthy citizens. Humble employment is degrading in this view, unless it's a stepping stone to "success". Note how conservative personalities commonly denigrate "burger flippers" and "useless degrees" because of their low economic value. This is a vision in which the interdependence of family and community life can only be crudely and unnaturally tacked on.
Let's talk about the women's vote. I've witnessed my wife giving birth five out of six times. Like many women, she's intelligent and hard working and capable of being an economic powerhouse. But nothing illuminates the natural and total dependence of women like pregnancy, childbirth, and being the mother of an infant. Dependence is built into female biology and the female psyche. Every woman intuitively knows - even if her feminist indoctrination doesn't let her admit it - that she is a dependent creature.
In light of this reality, the GOP has made a double mistake. First, exalting radical individualism is an anthropological error across the board. But it is less repulsive to men than it is to women. Men can permit themselves the fantasy without their biology interfering. Second, by embracing feminism and insisting that women and men share the same values - yes, the GOP has embraced feminism in almost every respect: recall the embarrassing parade of women and feminist lip service at the convention? - the GOP is asking women, who have an irrepressible and intuitive knowledge of human interdependence, to adopt a social and economic philosophy that is totally contrary to their nature.
Of course we lost the women's vote! And we lost the vote of millions of honest, hard-working, ordinary men for whom "upward mobility" is just not a priority, and for whom getting rich is either unattainable or uninspiring. They want to take care of their families and serve their communities, not claw their way to the top of the economic ladder. The GOP needs a new vision of the Good Life.
"radical individualism" - What is this? Being self-reliant and thinking individual freedom is radical? Since when? You lose individual freedom your economy and country will fail.
- Did we lose the "woman vote" or were women told the same lie over and over...don't you think that Georgetown lady demanding free condoms was a national disgrace? How could any honest woman identify with her?
- Who said "upward mobility" is not possible? Every economic study I have read said there is not a lack of upward mobility for most Americans...it goes back to desire, education and career choice.
What is a "good life" - More government? Do we need a "Fairness Dept?" - Their job is to make sure life is fair and reward those that feel cheated?
So you are a secession supporter.... which we like to call the minority, or losers of the election, however you wish to look at it.
Romney won 53% of the married women voters, I wouldn't call that "handily for Romney," I would call that roughly split. Also it sounds like you know very little about single women, and I have no interest in teaching you anything about them seeing as you probably won't listen.
Yet in the election you would like to call it a landslide.
Roughly half of this country voted that they don't like the current administration.
I will say it again. Voting nationally on social issues is just plain dumb. It's all about the money. State elections handle and take action on social issues.
In response to OP, undoubtedly you are right that the GOP needs a new vision, but I don't know of anyone out there who has the answer of what that vision might be. George Bush's 'compassionate conservatism' was an effort to answer, but it ended up as just Democrat-lite, a bridge to nowhere.
We just lost one election. I'm not sure it's time to re-tool from the ground up. Did the Democrats re-tool from the ground up after 2010? Not really...they kept Obama, Pelosi, and Reid, the same team, and the same vision. They just went to work and came up with new tactics, like the 'war on women' idea, better GOTV, etc.
I believe there will be better days ahead for conservatism. Look at our 'farm team' vs. what the Dem's have. We have Marco Rubio, Bobby Jindal, Susana Martinez, Nikki Haley, Rand Paul, Paul Ryan and others. They have Elizabeth Warren and Andrew Cuomo. A news story yesterday in my local paper had Joe Biden at the top of the list for 2016 Dem hopefuls.
Democrats right now are enjoying their victory toasts, but the morning will come when they wake up and realize we still have 8% unemployment, 15% U6 unemployment, $16 trillion debt, 5% decline in household income, etc.
Thanks for a serious response to the OP, wutitiz. I hope you're right. Agreed about "compassionate conservatism" being Democrat-lite and a failure.
But I still think it's the vision of the Good Life that wins elections, along with what another poster called "talking points", and the GOP has lots of room for improvement there.
As for the specifics of what the GOP's new vision of the Good Life ought to be, I think Front Porch Republic and the Distributist Review are good places to start for ideas.
So you are a secession supporter.... which we like to call the minority, or losers of the election, however you wish to look at it.
Romney won 53% of the married women voters, I wouldn't call that "handily for Romney," I would call that roughly split. Also it sounds like you know very little about single women, and I have no interest in teaching you anything about them seeing as you probably won't listen.
Last time they tried that we called them treasonous traitors and killed them wherever we found them under the direct orders of a republican president.
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which we like to call the minority, or losers of the election, however you wish to look at it.
The GOP needs a new vision
