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Well, the internet judges/jury have the homeowner convicted even before the trial. Yep,...he's guilty 'cause the internet lawyers already said so.
I never understand this concept...we're on an online forum discussing the incident but not supposed to form an opinion? I doubt the majority of us who are here will be asked to sit on the jury so what difference does it make? Its the same as watching a story on the news and thinking "oh yeah they're going to jail"...but I'm sure you don't do that either
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bideshi
What would you have done in that man's situation? Is your neighborhood immune from break-ins?
if I'm going to shoot to kill I'm gonna try to do it with the first shot. If I fail once they're down I'm gonna call the police BUT keep my gun aimed at them just in case. I'm certainly not going to drag them to another room to shoot them again.
I don't buy your concern. It does not match the attention getting, "execution" in the subject, not the "hunting them down" phrase in your comment.
The man was defending his "home", and quite possibly he thought himself. This man and his home had been violated multiple times. How should he react? "Oh, that's okay, you kids just need love and understanding. The kids were f***ups, bad seed, who were only going to go on to more violent crime. The only feeling bad for them is that they did not get the proper parenting, nor did society impress upon them what is right and wrong.
Frankly, moral absolutes no longer matter in our society. It is all about personal rights, ad infinitum, the pervasive what about me soliloquy that permeates our society. I realize that moral absolutes is at best a quaint thought, at worse 1950's Father Knows Best thinking. Or even, rwnj thinking, to some. But, the lack of moral absolutes is at the core of the slow decay of our society, and country.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PullMyFinger
This is a sad story all around. First off, it sounds like this man has been harassed and stolen from before from previous articles on this story. But today he admitted to first shooting them after they broke in and then "finishing them off" after they were down.
The teens were not armed.
I feel bad for the kids who lost their lives, but at the same time they screwed up big time. Anyone should know you are risking your life when you break into someone's home.
But it almost seems that this man was hunting them and laying in wait.
Regardless of what side of the gun debate you are on, this is a very sad story.
It does not at all boil down to marksmanship; it all boils down to INTENT. Ever read anything about law? You know, all that talk about distinguishing between first-degree murder, second-degree murder, manslaughter, etc. - why else do you think those concepts even exist? Intent is a cornerstone of modern criminal prosecution.
If you are in a situation where there is a reasonable expectation that you are in immediate danger, then you have the right to defend yourself with lethal force. Your primary intent driving your actions is really to defend your life.
On the other hand, if you are in a situation where there is no reasonable expectation that you are in immediate danger and you deploy lethal force on another person - and a clearly incapacitated person, at that - then it's going to be pretty damn hard paint a picture other than that your primary intent driving your actions was to deliberately kill that person. That's called murder, and the law has a few things to say about that.
Complicated?... It's really not complicated at all; it's simple.
Yes....But don't forget this man was in a situation....NOT of his making. His having to make those fight/flight decisions were the direct cause of the actions precipitated by the burglars. That will be considered. This man was in his home, minding his own business. This burglary was at noon. The man is in his basement....Those people had a led pipe....coming downstairs. What was there intent???
...And, having had 8 previous burglaries in a short time span...I believe his brother said w/in a couple/few years...WE do not know how he felt...WE do not know if/when he went over the edge. We do know that he was in his own home, Thanksgiving day....in his basement...Probably watching TV and cooking his bird...or planning to go to relatives for dinner. WE don't know about him, his intent....We DO KNOW THEIRS! We also know they had done the same thing to another neighbor the day before....The evidence was still in their vehicle. On a local radio show yesterday I did hear.. "that the locals were
First degree murder has at its core, premeditation. I doubt the man thought about this as it was going down, much less plotted it before hand. Your response is overwrought hyperbole.
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Originally Posted by whogo
No one defends the right to defend yourself and property more than I, but you can't finish them off. That is 1st degree murder.
I find it disturbing that so many people believe it is ok to execute someone for burglary.
I see two possibilities here. One is that most of these macho, internet tough guys have
watched too much TV and played too many video games and actually fantasize about shooting/killing someone. As mentioned earlier, some very sick people here.
Or two, these people are truely upset about crime. Ironically, some people believe in executing thieves, but I don't see any cry for justice for the banksters who stole billions.
If I had time (I don't), I would check the posting history of some of these internet tough guys and see if they are truely interested in justice, or if these are just sick people.
Too hardcore? No, this is what is wrong with society. That a man cannot defend his home and himself from being violated, yet again. Too hardcore, is that as a society we are not outraged at the treatment the man repeatedly received. Too soft, too, too soft, our society.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PullMyFinger
The thing is, young people die. They die when they drive too fast, get high and drive. Do stupid stuff like drinking beer on top of water towers and falling off. Everyone of us on this forum had a friend die as a teenager I bet from an accident or a stupid stunt.
These kids decided to jump in the Lion's cage and try to get out alive. They probably knew this guy was nuts and armed but did it anyway. Something a misguided teen will do. So they died.
But this guy is going to jail. This was just too hardcore for this society. 100 years ago he wouldn't have even been questioned for killing thieves on his property.
...and yet you don't know that you can't just execute an incapacitated person without facing severe legal consequences? Uh huh... ok then. I take it they don't rely on you for legal advice.
Wow...and what a credible legal text you cited there.
Another internet macho man.
cops do it all the time and get away with it. if you know what you are doing anyone can get away with it.
I'm not shooting to wound and then have you fall into me with the 8" blade as you die either....taking me with ya.
One to the head......or two to center mass then the head.
as taught in training, triple tap. 2 in the chest 1 in the head, until the threat is stopped. too bad the threat was not stopped until they got one in the head. they got what they deserved.
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Uh huh... ok then. I take it they don't rely on you for legal advice.
