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But how many years it likely to take to upgrade the physical plant? Between New York and Boston, the plan involved old rights of way that have been moribound for decades, And the NIMBYs, can be counted upon to throw a fit and use every delaying tactic in the book,
And I'm pretty sue that a new North (Hudson) River tunnel will have to be part of the plan; it's needed, no doubt, but if you thought Boston's "Big Dig" was a boondoggle, wait intil the "usual suspects" get started here.
Between Penn Station and Pelham Bay in the Beonx, there's not likely to be any alternative to the present route via Hell Gate Bridge. I douby if much can be done to impeove speeds here, and there will be similar bottlenecks in Newark, Philadelphia and Baltimore.
I'm not raising these issues simply to throw cold water on anybody's dreams. But I am trying to point out that the location of the projects -- and the politicized pressure it is certain to spawn -- will both increase the costs and lengthen the lead times.
It's just the way it is in the real world.
1. There haven't been any NIMBY opposition to any of the line upgrades , infact theres some YIMBYism in some parts of New England and NJ... Between New York and DC will not require any land seizing...so I doubt any NIMBYS would arise...
2. I don't think the North River Tunnels will be another Big Dig , the whole Gateway Project would only take 6 years to build....Tunneling would take 2 years , then the station Expansion and New Portal Bridges. The Big Dig was a burying project , this is a Tunneling project theres a difference in size and cost...
3. The Hell Gate line will be 4 tracked , and speeds upgraded to 125mph , the Pelham Bay Bridge will be replaced and the Shell Interlocking will be grade separated , most of which is underway as we speak. The Hell Gate line and West Side line will both be upgraded fully as part of the Penn Station access plans which have alot of support.
4. I think your being a little to repressed instead of open minded....and are going by old info...
Build me a bridge to Hawaii and i will ride it. I have crossed the USA 3 times on a motorcycle, circumnavigated NS Cdn on a motorcycle and took that bike home on the Ferry out of Yarmouth. lets see a train go there.
I have been to a few other places too but I flew there and drove there after because were we no trains and almost no roads to speak of.
The USA needs no high speed trains.... You can beat a train flying any day.. Once trains worked, their time has come and gone....
If trains are so hot let bring back the real coal burner and then i might dance and sing along
I won't pay 1 cent in taxes for trains..
Or so you've been brought up to believe. Don't worry, you will never cent of your money to drink that oilade.
Yeah those Stupid Germans built a road that is deeper than the frost goes and so can handle trucks with V2 rockets before WW-2. We Yanks ain't got a road like it, and for it we suffer repairs after repairs.
Worse those stupid Germans are solvent in the 21st century and make us Yanks look bad.. You don't see them wanting to waste time and money building toy trains..... Of course they don't have any area to compare with the USA either. Germany is slightly smaller than Montana.
It makes me wish I had German ancestry, but alas i am not any part a stupid German
As to trains and TSA...... wanna bet TSA isn't there all set and ready to poke and prod at you and yours...
You DID mean TSA right?
Thanks for the correction.
But it's not this or that country (or people) are better. The reasons are:
1) Nothing in US is planned with the future in mind. We all want everything instantly, immediately. In politics, our vision goes only as far as the fiscal cliff, or the next elections.
2) For a variety of reasons, the spirit we once had is not there anymore. It isn't the recession, or any economical hardships. It's our mindset. And, that's worse than any other factor.
yawn........... Is somebody really going to drive 200 miles to get on it and rent a car to drive another 200 miles when you can just drive to get there cleaner, faster and better rested?
For the Yay's here, just exactly where are YOU going to Ride this wasted effort. Or is it about jobs?
Right and that's why people don't fly. You can't land a 747 on the beach so you have to drive the whole way. No way anyone would even think about renting a car.
Amtrack? seriously? If we can't hit the Japan/Europe rates (Amtrack Acela is like average 55mph) than your right the game is lost. If trains can clock in at Average 100+ speeds with drop offs in Cities centers. . .you better bet business will take notice.
i agree with this in particular. if we half ass it like amtrak, sure, nobody will use it. i have to take a 2-hour bus ride to the nearest amtrak station, and i'm in a city of 100k that's a tourist destination at the beach.
if you have high speed connections between downtowns of various cities, then you're getting somewhere.
Chicago-St. Louis is about 300 miles, which is smack in the middle of the 150-500 mile range most experts agree is optimal for HSR routes. I would agree that a trans-continental HSR isn't realistic or even desirable, but as your link shows, runs between major cities of about that distance are eminently feasible.
The other side of the coin is also reflected in your link: improved passenger rail in the U.S. isn't only about shiny new train engines - it's also about organization and efficiency, such as moving freight traffic to different lines or different time windows in order to improve passenger schedules.
This really isn't that hard: rational improvements in planning and execution combined with relatively inexpensive improvements in existing rail infrastructure, topped off with judicious deployment of advanced HSR technology in strategic locations. It's the sort of elementary planning any decent staff officer can manage in five minutes straight from a deep sleep. It shouldn't be beyond the capactiy of 310 million Americans.
So would it be attractive to the public, to travel the distance in two hours?( or 90 minutes
without stops)
So would it be attractive to the public, to travel the distance in two hours?( or 90 minutes without stops)
If they were educated of facts, yes. Flights exist between Chicago to St Louis and take about 1 hour. Add another 1.5 hours (minimum) for airport formalities. So, you might sit waiting to board for about an hour, another hour in flight and about 30 minutes to exit.
Or, you can go to the railway station, 15-20 minutes before the train departs, have coffee, stretch/walk around or work on your laptop for next couple of hours. Or take a nap. Oh, and even if it is icy conditions outside.
Is there a good reason why someone would prefer to fly over a train service that basically gets you to your destination in greater comfort and more "me time"?
If they were educated of facts, yes. Flights exist between Chicago to St Louis and take about 1 hour. Add another 1.5 hours (minimum) for airport formalities. So, you might sit waiting to board for about an hour, another hour in flight and about 30 minutes to exit.
Or, you can go to the railway station, 15-20 minutes before the train departs, have coffee, stretch/walk around or work on your laptop for next couple of hours. Or take a nap. Oh, and even if it is icy conditions outside.
Is there a good reason why someone would prefer to fly over a train service that basically gets you to your destination in greater comfort and more "me time"?
simple
let's use a business trip from atlanta to milwaukee and return
flying:
take off to land 1hour 20 minutes....total travel time round trip...just under 3 hours...add 45 minute for security at the beginning side still only less than 5 hours total for the round trip
amtrak
time for one way 32 hours.....or 64 hours round trip....
simple
let's use a business trip from atlanta to milwaukee and return
I didn't ask anybody to prove that travel between Chicago to St Louis is different from Atlanta to Milwaukee.
"Conservatives".
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