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Old 12-02-2012, 09:56 PM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,218 posts, read 22,361,490 times
Reputation: 23858

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STEM doesn't go far enough.
Take a look a Canada's permanent visa requirements; besides math and science, Canada wants liberal arts as well. They want writers, musicians, artists, philosophers, and all those other majors our conservatives equate with liberalism. They make it hard on those who have more common expertise because Canada already has enough tradesmen, and their trades are all well protected; Canadians first in all of them.

Why is their list longer? Because Canada understands the value of getting people who can think outside the box. Their business sector has known this value for a very long time, and the values that come from a liberal arts degree often lead their science and industry into entirely new products and ways of thinking.

I know this from firsthand experience; I seriously considered moving there 7 years ago, and I talked to officials there in depth about it.
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Old 12-03-2012, 12:46 AM
 
9,229 posts, read 9,756,796 times
Reputation: 3316
Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
STEM doesn't go far enough.
Take a look a Canada's permanent visa requirements; besides math and science, Canada wants liberal arts as well. They want writers, musicians, artists, philosophers, and all those other majors our conservatives equate with liberalism. They make it hard on those who have more common expertise because Canada already has enough tradesmen, and their trades are all well protected; Canadians first in all of them.

Why is their list longer? Because Canada understands the value of getting people who can think outside the box. Their business sector has known this value for a very long time, and the values that come from a liberal arts degree often lead their science and industry into entirely new products and ways of thinking.

I know this from firsthand experience; I seriously considered moving there 7 years ago, and I talked to officials there in depth about it.
No. The problem is PhDs in English literature cannot find a job in the US already, why import more?
However, well established writers, actors etc. do get green cards easily.
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Old 12-03-2012, 12:52 AM
 
9,229 posts, read 9,756,796 times
Reputation: 3316
Quote:
Originally Posted by It'sAutomatic View Post
He's not for the bill because Republicans wouldn't go for it unless it reduced regular immigration, i.e. let 1,000 STEM candidates in and then turn away 1,000 other immigrants. I think adding BS amendments to a bill would make the Repubs obstructionist.
Seriously, why does the US still have the "lottery green card" program?

I mean, if you want to come to the US, fine, please prove you can contribute.
Lottery green card? Some bored guy in New Guinea plays a lottery online and then becomes a permanent resident of the US? What about an ambitious young scientist in India who wants to write a new computer operating system?
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Old 12-03-2012, 01:08 AM
 
Location: Perpetuality On Wheels
447 posts, read 495,984 times
Reputation: 143
Well I do think so called the lottery doesn't make sense at the beginning, not sure how people came out such "smarter" idea that gambling became the spirit of our society.
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Old 12-03-2012, 01:25 AM
 
Location: Too far from home.
8,732 posts, read 6,781,353 times
Reputation: 2374
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_windwalker View Post
I'm not surprised that they are having trouble finding qualified people. One of the worst downfalls for hiring people in this country, today, is the number of people on drugs. For anything that is considered "safety sensitive", from lab technicians to machine shops to truck drivers, someone that uses drugs can not be hired. For the same reason that various "over the counter" medications state that you are not to drive or operate equipment, anything that compromise a person's judgement disqualifies that person from employment.

And, I've lived in an area where I was considered a "MONUMENT". Just about the only person in the whole town that has never been arrested for anything, never used drugs in my life, and don't drink. Let a company try to hire people in that area, and how many candidates do they have to go through to find someone that can pass the pre-employment drug screening? How much does that testing cost before they can fill the position? There are companies that have moved from one state to another, half way across the country, in hopes of finding an "employable workforce", rather than going through 150 candidates to find one employable applicant.

So, if a company can not find the people and talent it needs, where else is it going to look?

However, I've also seen where a company did have people that could have been trained for a special piece of machinery, but chose to hire someone from another country in order to get special consideration for their taxes or other government benefits. I consider that to be a problem, not a solution.

"Give me just one generation of youth, and I'll transform the whole world.â€

Vladimir Lenin

Seems it took our government two generations. Deterioration of the education system and the failure on the war on drugs.
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:02 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,472,986 times
Reputation: 27720
The Dems don't want more educated STEM immigrants here legally but they are ok with uneducated poor immigrants here illegally ?
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:58 AM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,700,795 times
Reputation: 14818
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
I can only think it's because a Republican proposed it and no other reason.

Why else would the Dems be against wanting to bring smart people into this country ?
Because they care more about helping Americans first?

Gotta say, I am shocked by all of the anti-American sentiment evident in this thread.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:00 AM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,700,795 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet Jones View Post
Maybe you're the one hitting the crack pipe if you think there is a big drug problem among US STEM candidates. Maybe this is a problem among blue collar grunts, but I've never seen any drug issues when hiring at the white collar level.

BTW, this is nothing but another nail in the coffin of the US work for. The reason students will not pursue STEM degrees is that they no they will have no chance at a meaningful career thanks to the outsourcing traitors in corporate America. Flooding the country with more immigrants to take what few jobs remain is not going to improve the situation. Only ones pushing for STEM visas are greedy companies that are looking to further depress wages.
This, 1000%.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:01 AM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,700,795 times
Reputation: 14818
Quote:
Originally Posted by eskercurve View Post
The basic premise of this bill is flawed. There is not a shortage of STEM-trained Americans, there's been numerous articles about this topic. There's a shortage of STEM-trained Americans who are willing to be paid barely more than unskilled labor. Also, companies are unwilling to look at folks below a certain GPA, despite the fact that many of these folks are not dumb, they were just hurried through college because they couldn't afford to stay longer, and many of these folks also had part time jobs to pay for college. I know my GPA would have been worse if I had had to work.

Where do they find such willing folks? Overseas, those who want to get into the USA no matter what the cost.

My point here is you have to fix the problem. Don't have student loans accrue interest at all. Widen the support program for college students in STEM fields to cover full cost of tuition. And finally don't give tax breaks to companies who are unwilling to pay the rates that STEM trained professionals should command.
Excellent points.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:03 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,472,986 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerLily24 View Post
Because they care more about helping Americans first?

Gotta say, I am shocked by all of the anti-American sentiment evident in this thread.
How can you say that knowing the illegal problems we have today ?
How has Obama's deferred action and work authorization helped Americans ?
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