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Once again we have a situation in which a practical solution to a common concern becomes a greater problem than what it was intended to rectify.
Ask ten people who have been in unions about their experience and I'd guess seven of the ten would say the union did little or nothing for them and only concerned themselves with the members with highest seniority and the ****-ups who continually go running to the union because they have ****ed-up yet again.
If you are in one of those two groups, unions are the only way to go and the unions cater to these groups because they vote to keep them around.
However, if you are not in one of those groups, what you should be able to negotiate for yourself based on your skills and productivity is diverted to others.
Jobs in union shops are available to me today and in the area where I live, but to take one of those jobs I would have to accept a four to six dollar per hour pay cut, pay union dues and support an organization that places its own interests before my own.
Now you tell me I need to toss and turn at night worrying about what someone in upper management is knocking down.
I say get a life!
Quote:
Originally Posted by darstar
Its hard to believe you do not believe in a fair and balanced society, in this modern day and age.Thats's what it all boils down to the rich getting richer the middle class disappearing....is that what you want? If you do, you would be most happy living in a third world country, as thats whats happening now. Its not what the Unions are doing now, it is what they HAVE for us in the past, ....change society and help create a Middle Class, The rich have always paid more percentage wise in taxes. Why should it be different now ?We do run the fear of becoming a Fascist State where the biggest companies are in step with the Government in order to kill the little guy, they are doing a good job of that now....Take Wall mart, please, they need to be put under control now! No one Company should be aloud to grow so big on the backs of slave labor and then become the worlds largest retailer....its just not right !
Running to the front of the parade and pretending to lead again?
I get so tired of liberal union supporters taking credit for the Sun rising and the birds singing.
We spent a decade creating a fair and balanced society in the 1930s under Roosevelt and the New Deal sham only to end up with equalized poverty.
Eight years of tinkering and the unemployment rate was still in the double-digits prior to the military draft being reinstated in September 1940.
WWII created the middle-class' mid-century prosperity by reducing the number of able-bodied young men in the workforce (dead, disabled, MIA) and reducing foreign manufacturing powers (Britain, Germany, France, Japan, etc.) to smoldering ruins while the untouched US factories we built to support the war effort were easily retooled to produce consumer products after the war.
By 1975 the rest of the world had rebuilt their manufacturing capabilities and the US had replaced the generation of workers lost in WWII with more than enough men and a growing number of working women.
The glory days of industrial unionization fueled by foreign demand and American worker shortage were over along with our foreign trade surplus.
Since 1975 (the last year we had a trade surplus), unions and their supporters have seemed clueless that the rules of the game changed.
The strategy that worked in the 1950s is self-defeating in 2012.
As for this "fair" thing you keep bringing up, Capitalism works because of the consequences of failing to compete effectively tend to correct whatever decisions and actions led to this failing.
Unions, as they exist today in America, tend to prevent industry from making the corrections they need to in order to compete in the world market and for this reason they destroy American jobs.
First, there was a second recession in 1938, after some very good gain in 1937. We were coming out of the worst economic disaster our Country has ever Seen. Means little today, but Hoover had the recovery all wrong, was making things worse ...FDR saved the day, helped so many get a new start.So many things came out what FDR did, from new banking laws, to the TVA , rural electrification , coop's new and better farming practices. All this was close to me, I came from that part of the Country that needed help the most, rural America. FDR left a lasting impression on my Family , we all became lifelong Democrats, to this day, and proud of it.
Yes, FDR can be credited with just about everything you Right Wing conservatives hate. I can understand a debate, a different approach to running the Country, theory . What I can 't except is the lies, the mistruths, the deliberate attempts to kill our Country, our way of life, our freedoms, all for crazy religious preachings along with trying to run the lives of every woman in the country. This along with racial hate, gay marriage , lots of things that reaches into people's private lives and into their bedrooms.Yes, all this and more, everything else is lesser, not worth addressing. It's quite clear the American public have had enough. They have spoken, it's time to stop the fight and join us in running the country.
if I decide to go build a porch for 600 dollars and it takes me 3 days. I make 200 a day. I decide if i want to work 16 hours with no breaks, its up to me. If I feel like drinking a beer I will. If i feel like taking a week off so be it. we don't hate unions we just do not understand why people have to complain and cry about everything. I have been told I need to get a real job while I made 100k in cash in 1 year doing what I felt like doing. If I was in a union i would have to only work 40 hours, take unneeded breaks and pay money to some monopoly for absolutely no reason. unions were great in 1962.. nowadays they are just con artist....
I have recieved 3 job offers 2 of them were in ohio because of this post. anyone else in ohio need some work done? carpentry,plumbing,electrical,mechanical,roofing,w elding aluminum and stainless, and about anything else. If I can get about 6 jobs in advance near cleveland I will head that way..
First, there was a second recession in 1938, after some very good gain in 1937. We were coming out of the worst economic disaster our Country has ever Seen. Means little today, but Hoover had the recovery all wrong, was making things worse ...FDR saved the day, helped so many get a new start.So many things came out what FDR did, from new banking laws, to the TVA , rural electrification , coop's new and better farming practices. All this was close to me, I came from that part of the Country that needed help the most, rural America. FDR left a lasting impression on my Family , we all became lifelong Democrats, to this day, and proud of it.
Yes, FDR can be credited with just about everything you Right Wing conservatives hate. I can understand a debate, a different approach to running the Country, theory . What I can 't except is the lies, the mistruths, the deliberate attempts to kill our Country, our way of life, our freedoms, all for crazy religious preachings along with trying to run the lives of every woman in the country. This along with racial hate, gay marriage , lots of things that reaches into people's private lives and into their bedrooms.Yes, all this and more, everything else is lesser, not worth addressing. It's quite clear the American public have had enough. They have spoken, it's time to stop the fight and join us in running the country.
Swing and a miss!
Hoover did all the wrong things and FDR did all the wrong things that Hoover didn't get a chance to do.
FDR made enough people desperately dependent on government largess that he had to die in office to lose the presidency.
The only reason unemployment finally fell below pre-depression levels in 1941 is the reinstatement of the military draft in 1940 pulling millions of young men out of the workforce.
There was one failed economic experiment and one successful political one.
Democrats discovered a way to fail and still attach blame to their political opponents.
In the Orwellian world of Depression Era disinformation, it wasn't that government deficit spending failed to grow the economy as promised, but rather spending was insufficient to prevent recession.
Anything to avoid having to admit being wrong I guess...
"We have tried spending money. We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work. And I have just one interest, and if I am wrong … somebody else can have my job. I want to see this country prosperous. I want to see people get a job. I want to see people get enough to eat. We have never made good on our promises. … I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started. … And an enormous debt to boot."
Exactly so. The biggest problem are public sector unions where the "business" is a public service like education or transportation. The union minions do not view their "profession" as a business. They see themselves as providers of the "common good". Fact has shown that despite enormous dumping of money into our government schools, reading and math achievement over the past 30+ years has remained stagnant. Why?
85% of all union members in the US work for government at some level, local, State, or federal.
The unions found a protected niche that cannot be put out of business for lack of money. If you take unions off the government teat, you could almost cut government spending in half. Just like in business, the overwhelming largest expense in government is labor.
Conservatives dislike labor unions, because their member give to Democrats, rather than Republicans. That's why conservatives hate teachers so much.
This
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