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If you don't want to accept the legitimate definition of the word; speaking as a libertarian socialist, I respect your right to make up your own meanings for words.
Most of the world's libertarians have, historically, been leftists. Most of those in the world today are leftist. Egalitarian collectivists from the political left are, by definition anti-statist--they are libertarians.
Of course, one cannot be a Libertarian (member of The US Libertarian Party) and a leftist, since that political party is largely an ideological stepchild of The US Republican Party.
Leftists and repubs alike just want to co-opt and obfuscate the term as you are doing here.
Leftists and repubs alike just want to co-opt and obfuscate the term as you are doing here.
Joseph Dejacque was a French anarchist/communist in the middle of The Nineteenth Century. He is the first person known to have used the term "libertarian" as a designation for his personal political ideology. He even published a paper called The Libertarian. His views were widely adopted by other anti-authoritarian communists and socialists of the era.
It would be another hundred years before those on the political right in The US would utilize the term. Again, libertarianism is a rejection of authoritarianism. It is a position which can be encompassed within a wide variety of economic views.
I'm fine with those of you on the political right who use the term. I even agree with right-libertarians on many anti-statist positions (excessive police presence, domestic spying, The Federal Reserve Banking System, etc.). I just want folks to be educated and honest in using the term "libertarian".
My official political compass designation is a left leaning social libertarian (lower left quadrant).
I favor highly regulated capitalism, which is the opposite of liberal economics (neoliberalism). However, on social issues, I don't feel the government needs to be involved in such issues (libertarian) as abortion, drugs, and other "moral" legislation.
A true libertarian is little involvement in social and economic issues (bottom right corner).. a left leaning libertarian feels the government should have an active involvement in economic regulation for the well-being of its citizens. Very distinct difference compared to an anarchist-leaning libertarian.
Rep! Someone who understands that further descriptors are needed and not just 'Conservative' and 'Liberal'
I don't think you can be a Leftist and a Libertarian...Leftists want the Government to control and own everything (people exist for the purposes of the State) while Libertarians want very limited Government where the Govt exists for the purposes of individual (s).
There are areas where Leftists probably agree with Libertarians such as legalizing gay marriage and marijuana and reduced military.
My philosophy is that Gov exists to support the individual (s)...so President Obama works for me to support my interests and I don't work for him.
I don't think you can be a Leftist and a Libertarian...Leftists want the Government to control and own everything (people exist for the purposes of the State) while Libertarians want very limited Government where the Govt exists for the purposes of individual (s).
There are areas where Leftists probably agree with Libertarians such as legalizing gay marriage and marijuana and reduced military.
My philosophy is that Gov exists to support the individual (s)...so President Obama works for me to support my interests and I don't work for him.
That is probably all that we agree on. Though I'm not sure who hates us libertarians the most, the Democrats, or Republicans?
I don't think you can be a Leftist and a Libertarian...Leftists want the Government to control and own everything (people exist for the purposes of the State) while Libertarians want very limited Government where the Govt exists for the purposes of individual (s).
Yes, and there are different things this applies to. Let's recap:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler
There are areas where Leftists probably agree with Libertarians such as legalizing gay marriage and marijuana and reduced military.
Yes, this is called a social libertarian. Little to no government intervention on social issues.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler
My philosophy is that Gov exists to support the individual (s)...so President Obama works for me to support my interests and I don't work for him.
Yes, and I believe the government exists to support the economy through regulation of business in the best interests of the people. That is the opposite of classical liberalism (economic liberalism).
Most of the right wing throws out the world "liberal" when they have no idea what it actually means. Liber(tarianism) just means free from government.
@The OP: It depends on how you define "libertarian" and "leftist".
I myself can be considered both of these things using certain definitions. After all, I strongly support protecting and preserving individual rights, while I also support implementing some left-wing/liberal policies.
And most high earners live in areas with less violence, a quick police response, gated community, etc.. their taxes pay for better services.
What better services are they getting? Look at what they get in government services and benefits per dollar of local, state, and federal taxes paid, and look at who's getting MUCH more than they pay for:
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