Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I have a question for other gun owners. Would you agree that sales of guns by us who are not dealers in state face to face without any dealer or transfer agent and back ground check is a loop hole that should be plugged? If not why? I know selling guns and I have sold them this way and its perfectly legal in the states I lived in, its easy and convenient, but is loosing a bit of ease and possibly selling a gun to someone who is going to shoot their wife or what ever worth a bit more hassle? Is there consensus on this one issue?
I watched Joe Scarborough today and he said Glocks are not needed to protect your home. Well, he also said the 10mm was over kill, We as gun owners know that the 10mm was a failed experiment that is now not easy to find and expensive to shoot if you don't load. But its not really much different than a 9mm. What caliber is OK for home defence? I agree an AR is not a good choice for home defence unless you expect roving bands of home invaders who will siege your house. Its too big to walk around the house, its not easy to hide next to your bed, its penetration is way too much for tissue paper wall and can hurt unintended people. But a 12 gage shot gun is much more devastating then any hand gun caliber at short range. As much as I see some gun owners and the NRA hurting our cause by taking the we will not even talk about it, I don't see out lawing calibers or style of guns.
Its a bit confusing to try to work it out and its for this reason that there is not much done. I think we may have a few things we can do, but how much good that will accomplish is not very clear. To live in a society that has gun rights we may have to say this kind of thing will happen from time to time, or just say that we have to get rid of the second amendment. I am not saying either is the right way, I am just saying that I don't know if we can do it part way. As Lincoln said about slavery, its either going to be all one thing or all the other.
I own a 12 gauge shotgun for home defense and a 380 semi-automatic for close encounters. Shotguns are a much more suitable weapon for home defense than a handgun.
I have a question for other gun owners. Would you agree that sales of guns by us who are not dealers in state face to face without any dealer or transfer agent and back ground check is a loop hole that should be plugged? If not why? I know selling guns and I have sold them this way and its perfectly legal in the states I lived in, its easy and convenient, but is loosing a bit of ease and possibly selling a gun to someone who is going to shoot their wife or what ever worth a bit more hassle? Is there consensus on this one issue?
I watched Joe Scarborough today and he said Glocks are not needed to protect your home. Well, he also said the 10mm was over kill, We as gun owners know that the 10mm was a failed experiment that is now not easy to find and expensive to shoot if you don't load. But its not really much different than a 9mm. What caliber is OK for home defence? I agree an AR is not a good choice for home defence unless you expect roving bands of home invaders who will siege your house. Its too big to walk around the house, its not easy to hide next to your bed, its penetration is way too much for tissue paper wall and can hurt unintended people. But a 12 gage shot gun is much more devastating then any hand gun caliber at short range. As much as I see some gun owners and the NRA hurting our cause by taking the we will not even talk about it, I don't see out lawing calibers or style of guns.
Its a bit confusing to try to work it out and its for this reason that there is not much done. I think we may have a few things we can do, but how much good that will accomplish is not very clear. To live in a society that has gun rights we may have to say this kind of thing will happen from time to time, or just say that we have to get rid of the second amendment. I am not saying either is the right way, I am just saying that I don't know if we can do it part way. As Lincoln said about slavery, its either going to be all one thing or all the other.
If we want laws that state criminals cannot own or possess a gun, then we damn well better have regulations and laws that prevent them from being able to buy a gun.
I own a 12 gauge shotgun for home defense and a 380 semi-automatic for close encounters. Shotguns are a much more suitable weapon for home defense than a handgun.
A 12 gage is much better for home defence than a rifle for several reasons, but to qualify that I would say not a Remington 870 long bbl. Its got to be one of the short bbl guns. I am not sure that Scarborough saying no one needs a 10mm for home defence is helpful.
If we want laws that state criminals cannot own or possess a gun, then we damn well better have regulations and laws that prevent them from being able to buy a gun.
This is my point as well. Why does the NRA not stand up and say, we are not going along with the idea of getting rid of semi autos, but we will work with the other side on stopping private sales without back ground checks. This is as dumb as saying if you to go wal mart and buy oxy you have to have a prescription, but if you buy it form Somone in the parking lot, as long as you should have it, no one will ask and just buy away. Really? How long before a bustling trade in illegal drugs would be in every parking lot?
What is needed is just plain common sense. We need to adopt a more adult attitude about firearms that should be reflected in responsible gun laws. There is no reason for anyone not in the military or police service to have weapons designed for use in combat. Likewise, the public obsession over handguns for personal protection is beyond reason. Unless you are a qualified expert, or police-trained in handling small arms, it is a mistake to think you will be safe in you home with a loaded pistol. (You are more likely to shoot yourself than ward-off anyone intent on doing you harm.) If you must have a gun for protection, then get a 12 gauge, double-barrel shotgun, load it with medium bird-shot and keep it ready to hand. For most people, you are probably better protected with a cell phone with one-touch dialing for emergency calls.
This is my point as well. Why does the NRA not stand up and say, we are not going along with the idea of getting rid of semi autos, but we will work with the other side on stopping private sales without back ground checks. This is as dumb as saying if you to go wal mart and buy oxy you have to have a prescription, but if you buy it form Somone in the parking lot, as long as you should have it, no one will ask and just buy away. Really? How long before a bustling trade in illegal drugs would be in every parking lot?
Well, if you're stupid enough to enter into the criminal underworld of arms dealing, then go right ahead. Right now it's no different then selling someone a tennis racquet, which is absurd.
All of these pathetic arguments by gun nuts are tiring. "Do nothing and leave the status quo because I found some loophole in your legislation".
Nobody ever said laws stop all behavior that has been made illegal. This website is littered with flawed and childish logic spewed by gun lovers.
What is needed is just plain common sense. We need to adopt a more adult attitude about firearms that should be reflected in responsible gun laws. There is no reason for anyone not in the military or police service to have weapons designed for use in combat. Likewise, the public obsession over handguns for personal protection is beyond reason. Unless you are a qualified expert, or police-trained in handling small arms, it is a mistake to think you will be safe in you home with a loaded pistol. (You are more likely to shoot yourself than ward-off anyone intent on doing you harm.) If you must have a gun for protection, then get a 12 gauge, double-barrel shotgun, load it with medium bird-shot and keep it ready to hand. For most people, you are probably better protected with a cell phone with one-touch dialing for emergency calls.
I will not be disrespectful at all but I don't agree with your points. First do we need to talk about solutions to the problem? Absolutly we do and I agree the NRA and its take no prisoners and give no quarter is stupid. As for semi auto military style rifles being baned? No I don't agree. I will say that I go farther than the most of my fellow gun owners who think they should be able to buy a gun on the internet and have it shipped to their house. The NFA is in control of sales of legal full auto weapons. Its hard expensive and takes a lot of effort to go through the hoops to get one. This is why most people who buy one don't commit crimes and its very rare if ever anyone unstable used a legal full auto NFA weapon. So what if we clasified semi autos similar to the NFA weapons? You can own them but you can't just buy one you have to be checked and that gun can not be sold by you unless you find a buyer who will go through the same hoops you did. I bet the shooters mother would not have bought an AR.
I totaly dissagree with the idea that hand guns are not good for home or self defence. We were told that if the CCW shall issue passed it would be the wild west. and there have been very few issues with this. I know you can bring up some but its like anything there are counter balances where people have stopped crimes or saved lives because of being armed. Again if you try to just ban classes of firearms, you will only stiffen the NRA and gun owners into not working with you on common ground.
I watched Joe Scarborough today and he said Glocks are not needed to protect your home. Well, he also said the 10mm was over kill, We as gun owners know that the 10mm was a failed experiment that is now not easy to find and expensive to shoot if you don't load. But its not really much different than a 9mm. What caliber is OK for home defence? I agree an AR is not a good choice for home defence unless you expect roving bands of home invaders who will siege your house. Its too big to walk around the house, its not easy to hide next to your bed, its penetration is way too much for tissue paper wall and can hurt unintended people. But a 12 gage shot gun is much more devastating then any hand gun caliber at short range. As much as I see some gun owners and the NRA hurting our cause by taking the we will not even talk about it, I don't see out lawing calibers or style of guns.
Its a bit confusing to try to work it out and its for this reason that there is not much done. I think we may have a few things we can do, but how much good that will accomplish is not very clear. To live in a society that has gun rights we may have to say this kind of thing will happen from time to time, or just say that we have to get rid of the second amendment. I am not saying either is the right way, I am just saying that I don't know if we can do it part way. As Lincoln said about slavery, its either going to be all one thing or all the other.
A shotgun may indeed be a better option (than a Glock) for home defense, but the federal court system has ruled recently that the second amendment protects our rights to bear arms both at home, and in public, where a shotgun doesn't make much sense.
In a sense, gun rights is another iteration of an old debate we've had in this country since it was founded. The problem is there are a lot of different kids of lifestyles that we lead as US citizens, and laws that make sense in some places simply don't make sense in others. The second amendment is pretty much set in stone, at this point, at least with regards to the fact that there will never be a total gun ban in this country (the courts have ruled it protects an individual's right to bear arms, and nobody will be able to round up enough support to repeal the amendment, as it would require three fourths of the states, currently 38, to ratify this).
With regards to your question about background check loopholes, I honestly don't have a good answer for you. I've never purchased a gun this way and never sold a gun period. I doubt it is legal in California though (I admit I have no idea, I have no plans to purchase a gun this way).
Functionally an AR-15 is just a semi-automatic rifle. It looks scary, which I'm sure is why the mass-murderers use it, but under the hood it's very similar to a mini-14, and in many ways less deadly than the M14 and M1 Garand, which don't look evil at all, but fire the larger and more deadly .308 cartridge. I understand the desire to ban high-capacity magazines, but it only takes a few seconds to swap cartridges. Even if you impose fixed magazine requirements, many of the rifles can be converted to be top-loaded with stripper clips, which functions almost as fast as a standard magazine swap.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
