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Old 02-07-2013, 08:56 AM
 
1,923 posts, read 2,326,269 times
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So many people are against welfare and disability pensions for the truly needy and disabled. But if we have no safety net, and we force disabled people to work, how do we stop employers from doing this? Or is it.......survival of the fittest?

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Old 02-07-2013, 09:02 AM
 
Location: WY
6,216 posts, read 4,760,511 times
Reputation: 7811
Quote:
Originally Posted by parried View Post
So many people are against welfare and disability pensions for the truly needy and disabled. But if we have no safety net, and we force disabled people to work, how do we stop employers from doing this? Or is it.......survival of the fittest?

I'm not against welfare and disability for the truly needy. I'm against welfare and disability for the truly lazy.
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:22 AM
 
3,589 posts, read 6,579,684 times
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First there are truly disabled people. Yes, there needs to be a safety net.

However, (and I am a physician). I have seen far too many people on disability walk into my office. I am looking at my other staff and saying WTF? Why is this person disability.

My best estimate, probably 20-30% of people on disability should still be able to get a job.

Many of these patients I see are simply overweight with back problems. Depending on your line of work, you can still work with back problems. Maybe not in construction or heavy duty jobs. But you can still find work. Yes there are still programs people can get into to reinvent themselves. But many times, I see people lack motivation. It's unfortunate many people

FYI: I do know it usually takes 3-4 years to qualify for disability.

My real question is why not carry disability insurance for yourself? I carry disability insurance in the event I have an accident/cancer diagnosis etc. This is in addition to my regular life insurance.

Depending on your income level, disability insurance can cost less than what most people pay for their cell phone bills each month. Think about that.
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:25 AM
 
2,083 posts, read 1,562,957 times
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Most conservatives that I know don't oppose all welfare and other programs that benefit those who honestly need our help. What we oppose is the generational dependency these programs tend to encourage. We're raising generations of people who are taught by their parents how to take advantage of handouts, because either that's all they know or because it's easier than working. When people on welfare, food stamps and housing assistance can afford luxuries like nice cars and designer clothes, it just creates more animosity towards both these people and the programs. We're enabling people to game the system rather than becoming productive citizens, and this needs to stop.

We want these systems to be overhauled, both so that people can't make a living by being a baby factory and so that it doesn't continue to grow into a bigger burden for taxpayers.
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:30 AM
 
11,357 posts, read 5,664,053 times
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I`m 95% in agreement with you but I`d be surprised if anyone is having babies to get a bigger check. Raising children is a full time job and a difficult one at that.
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:38 AM
 
Location: Australia
1,057 posts, read 1,632,858 times
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I don't know anyone who is against welfare for the truly disabled. I do oppose welfare payments for people like Octomom and Angel Adams though.
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:40 AM
 
13,158 posts, read 8,249,896 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aneftp View Post
First there are truly disabled people. Yes, there needs to be a safety net.

However, (and I am a physician). I have seen far too many people on disability walk into my office. I am looking at my other staff and saying WTF? Why is this person disability.

My best estimate, probably 20-30% of people on disability should still be able to get a job.

Many of these patients I see are simply overweight with back problems. Depending on your line of work, you can still work with back problems. Maybe not in construction or heavy duty jobs. But you can still find work. Yes there are still programs people can get into to reinvent themselves. But many times, I see people lack motivation. It's unfortunate many people

FYI: I do know it usually takes 3-4 years to qualify for disability.

My real question is why not carry disability insurance for yourself? I carry disability insurance in the event I have an accident/cancer diagnosis etc. This is in addition to my regular life insurance.

Depending on your income level, disability insurance can cost less than what most people pay for their cell phone bills each month. Think about that.
What I enjoy is when a claimant appears before an administrative law judge, morbidly obese, claiming that 'my doctor told me not to walk'. Nine times out of ten, I will find statements by the claimant's doctor urging the claimant to walk as much as possible.

On disability insurance: I will note that the 'five month waiting period' (for Titlel II disability benefits) was imposed by Congress (way back when) on the presumption that most people would have some type of private disability insurance to pay for their first five months of disability (since a lot of such private disability programs are, in fact, limited in scope).
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:41 AM
 
Location: Palo Alto
12,149 posts, read 8,101,896 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmagoo View Post
I`m 95% in agreement with you but I`d be surprised if anyone is having babies to get a bigger check. Raising children is a full time job and a difficult one at that.
Who said they were raising them?
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:45 AM
 
20,078 posts, read 11,586,249 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parried View Post
So many people are against welfare and disability pensions for the truly needy and disabled. But if we have no safety net, and we force disabled people to work, how do we stop employers from doing this? Or is it.......survival of the fittest?


your OP is a lie. NONE of us who are for responsible government are against helping the truely needy.

What we are against is government creating clients out of those who are NOT truely needy.

YOU need to stop being silly and putting up strawman arguments that have no basis in reality.
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
So many people are against welfare and disability pensions for the truly needy and disabled.
"So many" isn't really that many.

Aside from far out libertarians who don't accept that society should even exist and a handful of crackpots posting on internet forums, I think the vast majority of people want social programs for the truly needy and disabled.

The problem is able people who simply refuse to work. They make the system unsustainable and make the people who are genuinely disabled look suspect. They should be tossed into jail along with the lawyers who helped them defraud the system.
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