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Old 02-13-2013, 02:54 PM
 
9,855 posts, read 15,205,540 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
I would be okay with no minimum wage if we also had a free market in housing and real estate.

Conservatives are unwilling to allow the latter, and I maintain that a minimum wage is an unfortunate but necessary price of an unfree housing market.

If an employer is free to pay say $2 per hour, a landlord or developer should also be free to provide housing affordable to the worker earning $2 per hour.

I'd love to hear objections that do not entail class warfare.
When you talk about not having a free market in real estate, are you talking about how fannie mae and freddie mac allow people who really can't afford to buy homes easier access to those homes at the cost of the government carrying undue risk?

Your 'unfree housing market' makes it easier to buy a house.
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Old 02-13-2013, 02:55 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,455,098 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speleothem View Post
We don't pay anyone minimum wage,
but if the MW goes up by two bucks,
everyone is gonna want a two buck raise.

"Marginal impact on employers?"

Oh well, everybody loves inflation, right?

I had a job delivering pizzas where I was paid 20 cents above minimum wage. When the minimum wage eas increased, my new wage was trhe new minimum.

Nothing says employers HAVE to raise wages of employees earning more than minimum wage.
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Old 02-13-2013, 02:59 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,455,098 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
When you talk about not having a free market in real estate, are you talking about how fannie mae and freddie mac allow people who really can't afford to buy homes easier access to those homes at the cost of the government carrying undue risk?

Your 'unfree housing market' makes it easier to buy a house.

That is part of it. My solution is NOT for government to prod lenders or allow unqualified buyers to get into homes they cannot afford.

My solution is to minimize government intrusion into the market, maximize economic liberty, and allow a willing seller to sell homes people can afford to buy.

Nobody would get into a home they cannot afford, but government would no longer prevent property owners from selling affordable homes.
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Old 02-13-2013, 02:59 PM
 
9,855 posts, read 15,205,540 times
Reputation: 5481
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
I had a job delivering pizzas where I was paid 20 cents above minimum wage. When the minimum wage eas increased, my new wage was trhe new minimum.

Nothing says employers HAVE to raise wages of employees earning more than minimum wage.
Then why didn't you quit and find a job that did pay $0.20 over minimum? You are to blame for that, not the pizza shop.


Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
That is part of it. My solution is NOT for government to prod lenders or allow unqualified buyers to get into homes they cannot afford.

My solution is to minimize government intrusion into the market, maximize economic liberty, and allow a willing seller to sell homes people can afford to buy.

Nobody would get into a home they cannot afford, but government would no longer prevent property owners from selling affordable homes.

How does the government prevent anyone from selling affordable homes?
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Old 02-13-2013, 03:18 PM
 
Location: Louisiana
9,138 posts, read 5,802,841 times
Reputation: 7706
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
I had a job delivering pizzas where I was paid 20 cents above minimum wage. When the minimum wage eas increased, my new wage was trhe new minimum.

Nothing says employers HAVE to raise wages of employees earning more than minimum wage.

Right; nobody says you HAVE to.
Tell that to the long time employees after
new hires now make as much as they do.
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Old 02-13-2013, 03:19 PM
 
17,401 posts, read 11,975,567 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks View Post
It says a lot about a person who gets all worked about raising the minimum wage a dollar or two.
It says a lot more about a person that thinks it's OK for the federal government to control the free market.
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Old 02-13-2013, 04:01 PM
 
4,278 posts, read 5,177,911 times
Reputation: 2375
Raising it will just force small businesses to lay off workers or not hire more in order to expand. We will have fewer, but larger companies, less competition, and higher prices. I could see giving the employer the option to raise it, but then he can shift the
cost of unemployment insurance and workman comp. insurance to the employee. The employee can either buy these two insurance policies or just forgo them altogether.
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Old 02-13-2013, 05:04 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,455,098 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
Then why didn't you quit and find a job that did pay $0.20 over minimum? You are to blame for that, not the pizza shop.

How does the government prevent anyone from selling affordable homes?

1) This was in a college town, huge surplus of labor.

2) Minimum lot size requirements. I rented a cottage once and tried to buy it when the owners moved but the lot could not be legally split so my only options were to buy two houses (unaffordable) or none.
Note that this is NOT the usual 'health and safety' issue commonly raised, as the cottage was legal as a stand-alone rental but not as a stand-alone sale or purchase.
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Old 02-13-2013, 05:05 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,455,098 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speleothem View Post
Right; nobody says you HAVE to.
Tell that to the long time employees after
new hires now make as much as they do.

If they don't like it they can vote with their feet right?
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Old 02-13-2013, 05:06 PM
 
Location: Louisiana
9,138 posts, read 5,802,841 times
Reputation: 7706
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
If they don't like it they can vote with their feet right?

Cool. All my employees quit?
Problem solved.
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