Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 02-27-2013, 02:02 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,443,387 times
Reputation: 9074

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero View Post
because '''resential'' single family RENTAL is still an INCOME PRODUCING property....ie commercial property...it is NO LONGER residential


a different example

a person OWNS A HOME...choses to use the home and open up a DENTAL business from PART of the home...that home is NO LONGER RESIDENTIAL...it is now comercial (at least in NY (I dont know the rules for the other states))

???
res·i·den·tial

/ˌrezəˈdenCHəl/
Adjective
  • Designed for people to live in.
  • Providing accommodations in addition to other services.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-27-2013, 02:08 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,443,387 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Depends on whether we have inflation or deflation, and if the value of the investments in which the money is held appreciates or depreciates.

If you want the fair tax, then spending is taxed. Saving isn't taxed. No time limits on either.

Maybe yes maybe no, because some spennding is more equal than others.

Homeowner buys an existing home, no tax. Renter rents the same existing home, $$$
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-27-2013, 02:13 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,443,387 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by lycos679 View Post
There is NO Fairtax assessed on homes or rents.

Source, please.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-27-2013, 02:37 PM
 
20,706 posts, read 19,349,208 times
Reputation: 8278
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Source, please.

What is the FairTax | What is a Consumption Tax | Tax Reform Solutions - Americans For Fair Taxation
Under the FairTax, every person living in the United States pays a sales tax on purchases of new goods and services,excluding necessities due to the prebate.

Its a bit nicer version of this one.

FRENCH REVOLUTION
[SIZE=2]The French had good reasons for wanting equality. Before 1789 inequality was typical of the old government. The nobles and clergy were the privileged orders. They were exempt from such direct taxes as the taille, or land tax. Most taxes were paid by the Third Estate--a class that included peasants, artisans, merchants, and professional men.

[/SIZE]
Only goods and service are taxed, meaning those who work. In other words someone who sells hotdogs in a good location pays the same tax as one who sells hot dogs in a bad location. The good location sells it for say $5 and the bad location for $3. One pays $1.15 out of a $3 profit on a $2 cost of goods sold or net $1.85. The other pays .69 in tax or 31 cents in profit less $2 cost of good sold. $1.85 = 31 cents. That's " the fair tax" which knows not location, location,location. Its fair for the long hair , blue bloods , Hapsburgs , Bourbons, and feudalistic dirt bagger.


I call it the idiot tax.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2013, 05:48 PM
 
Location: Texas
5,068 posts, read 10,128,114 times
Reputation: 1651
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
If renters pay NOTHING, it's okay to tax rental property at exorbitant rates right? Like, say, 5 times the rate owner-occupied homes are taxed. Renters pay nothing, so they should be oblivious to it.

Homeowner pays $1000 mortgage payment (includes property taxes, renter pays $1000 rent, renter pays WAY more FAIRtAX THAN HOMEOWNER on equal spending, not to mention that the homeowner enjoyed greater consumption than the renter.
I think I'd for a house, even if it's a starter house, then it could be used as a down payment. That way, the FairTax wouldn't affect someone in your place.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2013, 06:01 PM
 
11,768 posts, read 10,257,576 times
Reputation: 3444
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Source, please.
"Those who do not itemize get no advantages at all. Under the FairTax, all homeowners make their entire house payment with pre-tax dollars."

What is the FairTax | What is a Consumption Tax | Answers on Tax Reform - Americans For Fair Taxation
http://www.fairtax.org/PDF/PromotingHomeOwnership.pdf
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2013, 06:22 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,443,387 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by lycos679 View Post
"Those who do not itemize get no advantages at all. Under the FairTax, all homeowners make their entire house payment with pre-tax dollars."

What is the FairTax | What is a Consumption Tax | Answers on Tax Reform - Americans For Fair Taxation
http://www.fairtax.org/PDF/PromotingHomeOwnership.pdf

Okay, you've covered the HOMES (homeowner) part.

Now what's your source for saying rents are not taxed?

BTW, the insurance component of a homeowner's mortgage payment (liability and casualty insurance plus MIP) and part of the mortgage interest are subject to FairTax, but not the mortgage principal and the property taxes.)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2013, 06:44 PM
 
11,768 posts, read 10,257,576 times
Reputation: 3444
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Okay, you've covered the HOMES (homeowner) part.

Now what's your source for saying rents are not taxed?

BTW, the insurance component of a homeowner's mortgage payment (liability and casualty insurance plus MIP) and part of the mortgage interest are subject to FairTax, but not the mortgage principal and the property taxes.)
Ok, I was wrong it DOES tax rent - that's F'd up. This law benefits people making less than $24K and more than $200K. Soak the middle class! Then again if prices drop the Fairtax would be a wash.



FactCheck.org: Unspinning the FairTax

"Other types of services would also be subject to the FairTax. For multifamily rental property, all rental payments made by tenants to property owners would be subject to the sales tax. While it is true that such payments would be made from the tenant’s now untaxed income, the relative price of housing costs (whether mortgage payments or rental payments) would be higher relative to other purchases or investments, such as stocks, and this would reduce the overall demand for housing and housing improvements."


NAHB: The Effect of the FairTax Proposal on Housing and Home Building
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2013, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Texas
5,068 posts, read 10,128,114 times
Reputation: 1651
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
empowering the government with more taxpayer is not the answer, downsizing it drastically is.
Actually, with the FairTax, government will get the same amount of taxes -- maybe less.

And, since there are approximately 11million illegals in the country, they will not be able to get the prebate, along with crooks and international travelers. And, since that money isn't going to those people, it means we can use that money to save Social Security. It's "the gift that keeps on giving"!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2013, 09:12 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,443,387 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by lycos679 View Post
Ok, I was wrong it DOES tax rent - that's F'd up. This law benefits people making less than $24K and more than $200K. Soak the middle class! Then again if prices drop the Fairtax would be a wash.



FactCheck.org: Unspinning the FairTax

"Other types of services would also be subject to the FairTax. For multifamily rental property, all rental payments made by tenants to property owners would be subject to the sales tax. While it is true that such payments would be made from the tenant’s now untaxed income, the relative price of housing costs (whether mortgage payments or rental payments) would be higher relative to other purchases or investments, such as stocks, and this would reduce the overall demand for housing and housing improvements."


NAHB: The Effect of the FairTax Proposal on Housing and Home Building

I see a few problems with this:

1) Rental property currently is treated favorably under the income tax - so much so that there is currently little (landlords') income tax embedded in rents. Hence, the FairTax won't give landlords much cost relief, so there is little room for (pre-tax) rents to fall.

2) On average, renters have only about half the income of the median homeowner. One-half of all low income renters spend at least half their income on shelter. For most renters, and especially for low-income renters, the failure of rents to fall under the FairTax, combined with the high proportion of renters' income spent on rent, will quickly eat up the entire prebate. As a result, most renters will LOSE purchasing power under the FairTax.

3) Property taxes are the largest tax embedded in rent, are completely unaffected by FairTax and in many states are higher on rental property than on owner-occupied homes. The FairTax, when applied to rents, is effectively a tax on top of a tax on top of a tax.

4) Because rental and purchase are taxed differently, a renter will always pay more tax than a homeowner with equal spending/consumption. Also, since homeowners have the opportunity to consume housing without paying tax, equal consumption always costs a renter more that a homeowner, and when spending is equal the homeowner gets more consumption than the renter.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top