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Old 03-21-2013, 09:17 PM
 
Location: London, NYC, DC
1,118 posts, read 2,279,084 times
Reputation: 672

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
No civil union is federally recognized, so none of the federal protections and rights (over 1400) apply. Also while marriage is legal in every state many states do not even have legal civil unions.
Actually, no civil union or state-recognised gay marriage is federally recognised, so getting married to someone of the same-sex in New York, for example, is as worthless at the federal level as not being able to be married in Alabama. I still wonder how gay marriage somehow escapes full faith and credit, since that would solve a lot of these problems…

 
Old 03-22-2013, 06:24 AM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
24,261 posts, read 14,121,221 times
Reputation: 9895
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoking66 View Post
Actually, no civil union or state-recognised gay marriage is federally recognised, so getting married to someone of the same-sex in New York, for example, is as worthless at the federal level as not being able to be married in Alabama. I still wonder how gay marriage somehow escapes full faith and credit, since that would solve a lot of these problems…
When DOMA is found unconstitutional all same sex marriages will be federally recognized.
 
Old 03-22-2013, 06:45 AM
 
Location: S.E. US
13,163 posts, read 1,632,048 times
Reputation: 5131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Griffis View Post
Fact of the matter is, there is not one single reason--none whatsoever--to oppose same sex marriage that doesn't arise from hatred, fear, ignorance, bigotry, or some combination of those things. None.

To preclude consensual adult couples from marrying based solely on their gender is the very definition of discrimination and bigotry.
Your definition. Not mine.

You can't nullify what you don't like by calling it hatred, fear, ignorance and bigotry.
 
Old 03-22-2013, 07:31 AM
 
Location: Deep Dirty South
5,190 posts, read 5,312,527 times
Reputation: 3863
Quote:
Originally Posted by southward bound View Post
Your definition. Not mine.

You can't nullify what you don't like by calling it hatred, fear, ignorance and bigotry.
Hatred, ignorance, fear and bigotry is what it is. There ARE no other reasons to oppose same sex marriage. And you cannot provide any, so you fail.

And you can't nullify inclusion and equality by claiming something doesn't live up to your personal definition.

Welcome out of the Dark Ages.
 
Old 03-22-2013, 07:42 AM
 
Location: NH
4,186 posts, read 3,712,788 times
Reputation: 6703
Im not arguing here, just stating my opinion. I think a marriage should be between a man and a women and gay couples should have a civil union.
 
Old 03-22-2013, 08:01 AM
 
Location: Dallas area, Texas
2,353 posts, read 3,838,979 times
Reputation: 4173
Quote:
Originally Posted by mustangman66 View Post
Im not arguing here, just stating my opinion. I think a marriage should be between a man and a women and gay couples should have a civil union.
So, you do not believe The Declaration of Independence where it says that "All men are created equal"? You think that same-sex couples are unequal, and should remain unequal?
 
Old 03-22-2013, 08:29 AM
 
15,706 posts, read 11,716,832 times
Reputation: 7019
Quote:
Originally Posted by mustangman66 View Post
Im not arguing here, just stating my opinion. I think a marriage should be between a man and a women and gay couples should have a civil union.
Separate but equal never is. Civl Unions do not grant the same rights as a marriage license in this country.
 
Old 03-22-2013, 12:32 PM
 
Location: Billings, MT
9,885 posts, read 10,901,539 times
Reputation: 14180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiyero View Post
Separate but equal never is. Civl Unions do not grant the same rights as a marriage license in this country.
They should. It is just that simple, make "Civil Union" exactly the same as marriage in every LEGAL way!
Actually, I have decided, after much thought, that I really don't care what it is called. "Marriage" is just a word, "Civil Union" is just a phrase. After thinking it over, I am fully in favor of homosexuals getting married.
For one simple reason: WHEN they get married, they can't just agree to go their separate ways. THEY HAVE TO GET A DIVORCE! Yep, they have to go through all the pain and expense of a heterosexual couple who decides to "split the sheets"! Attorney fees, division of property, alimony, child support, court costs, the whole bit is now THEIR problem just as it is for heteros!
In fact, I heard that one of the first homosexual couples to get married in California, who had been together for 30 years or so, wound up in divorce court within a year of their marriage! I guess they couldn't stand the full commitment of marriage!
I thought it was hilarious!
You bet, give them the full benefit of MARRIAGE, as well as all the problems!
 
Old 03-22-2013, 07:12 PM
 
17,842 posts, read 14,323,195 times
Reputation: 4113
Quote:
Originally Posted by southward bound View Post
Really?

And do you have medical/scientific proof that one does not choose to be gay? Is homosexuality genetically linked? Is it inherited, like eye color?

Royal College of Psychiatrists
"Despite almost a century of psychoanalytic and psychological speculation, there is no substantive evidence to support the suggestion that the nature of parenting or early childhood experiences play any role in the formation of a person’s fundamental heterosexual or homosexual orientation. It would appear that sexual orientation is biological in nature, determined by a complex interplay of genetic factors and the early uterine environment."



American Academy of Pediatrics
“…the current literature and most scholars in the field state that one’s sexual orientation is not a choice; that is, individuals do not choose to be homosexual or heterosexual.”


American Academy of Pediatricians
"there is no scientific evidence that abnormal parenting, sexual abuse, or other adverse life events influence sexual orientation."


Sexual hormones and the brain: an essential alliance for sexual identity and sexual orientation (2010)
Endocr Dev. 2010;17:22-35. Epub 2009 Nov 24. Garcia-Falgueras A, Swaab DF.
The fetal brain develops during the intrauterine period in the male direction through a direct action of testosterone on the developing nerve cells, or in the female direction through the absence of this hormone surge. In this way, our gender identity (the conviction of belonging to the male or female gender) and sexual orientation are programmed or organized into our brain structures when we are still in the womb.

There is no indication that social environment after birth has an effect on gender identity or sexual orientation.



Brain scans have provided the most compelling evidence yet that being gay or straight is a biologically fixed trait.
The scans reveal that in gay people, key structures of the brain governing emotion, mood, anxiety and aggressiveness resemble those in straight people of the opposite sex.

"This is the most robust measure so far of cerebral differences between homosexual and heterosexual subjects," she says.

Previous studies have also shown differences inbrain architecture and activity between gay and straight people, but most relied on people's responses to sexuality driven cues that could have been learned, such as rating the attractiveness of male or female faces.

To get round this, Savic and her colleague, Per Lindström, chose to measure brain parameters likely to have been fixed at birth.

"That was the whole point of the study, to show parameters that differ, but which couldn't be altered by learning or cognitive processes," says Savic.

"This study demonstrates that homosexuals of both sexes show strong cross-sex shifts in brain symmetry," says Qazi Rahman, a leading researcher on sexual orientation at Queen Mary college, University of London, UK.

"The connectivity differences reported in the amygdala are striking."
"Paradoxically, it's more informative to look at things that have no direct connection with sexual orientation, and that's where this study scores," says Simon LeVay, a prominent US author who in 1991 reported finding differences(pdf) in a part of the brain called the hypothalamus between straight and gay men.




PET and MRI show differences in cerebral asymmetry and functional connectivity between homo- and heterosexual subjects
http://www.pnas.org/content/early/20...66105.abstract


"Epigenetics – how gene expression is regulated by temporary switches, called epi-marks – appears to be a critical and overlooked factor contributing to the long-standing puzzle of why homosexuality occurs". In the current study, researchers... integrated evolutionary theory with recent advances in the molecular regulation of gene expression and androgen-dependent sexual development to produce a biological and mathematical model that delineates the role of epigenetics in homosexuality" (2012)
http://www.sciencenewsline.com/artic...116360019.html


"There's a converging line of evidence between the hormonal studies, the genetic studies , and the neuroanatomical studies. My research has identified candidate genes within these new chromosomal regions that could link together all of these different findings”

Mustanski, B. S.; DuPree, M. G.; Nievergelt, C. M.; Bocklandt, S.; Schork, N. J.; Hamer, D. H. (2005)
A genomewide scan of male sexual orientation. [Hum Genet. 2005] - PubMed result



Relationships among childhood sex-atypical be... [Arch Sex Behav. 2002] - PubMed - NCBI

Several studies report that the cognitive performance of gay males is more typical of heterosexual females than heterosexual males.

Furthermore, the brain waves of gay males while performing verbal and spatial tasks are more similar to heterosexual females than males or significantly different from both."

Relationships among childhood sex-atypical behavior, spatial ability, handedness, and sexual orientation in men. Cohen KM. Arch Sex Behav. (2002)
________________________________________________


And a few more brain studies:

Sexual orientation and its basis in brain structure and function

PET and MRI show differences in cerebral asymmetry and functional connectivity between homo- and heterosexual subjects

Brain response to putative pheromones in homosexual men

Sexual orientation and the size of the anterior commissure in the human brain

Brain response to putative pheromones in lesbian women

http://reberlab.psych.northwestern.e...ron_BN2007.pdf

and a few more studies:


Camperio Ciani, A., Cermelli, P., & Zanzotto, G. (2008). Sexually
antagonistic selection in human male homosexuality. Plos One, in
press.

Rahman, Q., Collins, A., Morrison, M., Orrells, J. C., Cadinouche, K.,
Greenfield, S., et al. (2008). Maternal inheritance and familial
fecundity factors in male homosexuality. Archives of Sexual
Behavior, 37.

Camperio Ciani, A., Iemmola, F., & Lombardi, L. (2008). Male
homosexuality partly correlates with an increased androphilia
and fecundity in females from maternal line

Vasey, P. L., & VanderLaan, D. P. (2007). Birth order and male
androphilia in Samoan fa’afafine. Proceedings of the Royal
Society of London, Series B: Biological Sciences, 274, 1437–1442.

Blanchard, R., & Lippa, R. A. (2007). Birth order, sibling sex ratio,
handedness, and sexual orientation of male and female participants
Archives of Sexual Behavior, 36, 163–176.

Savolainen,V.,&Lehmann,L. (2007). Genetics and bisexuality. Nature,
445, 158–159.

Bogaert, A. F. (2006). Biological versus nonbiological older brothers
and men’s sexual orientation. Proceedings of the National
Academy of Sciences, 103, 10771–10774.

Rahman, Q., & Hull, M. S. (2005). An empirical test of the kin
selection hypothesis for male homosexuality. Archives of Sexual
Behavior, 34, 461–467.

King, M., Green, J., Osborn, D. P. J., Arkell, J., Hetherton, J., &
Pereira, E. (2005). Family size in white gay and heterosexual men.
Archives of Sexual Behavior, 34, 117–122.

Camperio Ciani, A., Corna, F., & Capiluppi, C. (2004). Evidence for
maternally inherited factors favouring male homosexuality and
promoting female fecundity. Proceedings of the Royal Society of
London, Series B: Biological Sciences, 271, 2217–2221.

DuPree,M.G.,Mustanski, B. S.,Bocklandt, S., Nievergelt, C.,&Hamer,
D. H. (2004). A candidate gene study of CYP19 (aromatase) and
male sexual orientation. Behavior Genetics, 34, 243–250.

Blanchard, R. (2004). Quantitative and theoretical analyses of the
relation between older brothers and homosexuality in men.
Journal of Theoretical Biology, 230, 173–187.

Bobrow, D., & Bailey, J. M. (2001). Is male homosexuality maintained
via kin selection? Evolution and Human Behavior, 22, 361–368.

Bailey, J. M., Pillard, R. C., Dawood, K., Miller, M. B., Farrer, L. A.,
Tivedi, S., et al. (1999). A family history study of male sexual
orientation using three independent samples. Behavior Genetics,
29, 79–86.

Blanchard, R. (1997). Birth order and sibling sex ratio in homosexual
versus heterosexual males and females. Annual Review of Sex
Research, 8, 27–67.

Blanchard, R., & Klassen, P. (1997). H-Y antigen and homosexuality
in men. Journal of Theoretical Biology, 185, 373–378.

Hu,S., Pattatucci,A.M., Patterson, C.,Li,L.,Fulker,D.W.,Cherny, S.S.,
et al. (1995). Linkage between sexual orientation and chromosome
Xq28 in males but not in females. Nature Genetics, 11, 248–256.

Vasey, P. L. (1995). Homosexual behavior in primates: A review of
evidence and theory. International Journal of Primatology, 16,
173–204.

Hamer, D. H., Hu, S., Magnuson, V. L., Hu, N., & Pattattucci, A. M.
(1993). A linkage between DNA markers on the X chromosome
and male sexual orientation. Science, 261, 321–327.


Bailey, J. M., & Pillard, R. C. (1991). A genetic study of male sexual
orientation. Archives of General Psychiatry, 48, 1089–1096.
 
Old 03-23-2013, 01:13 AM
 
2,345 posts, read 1,661,532 times
Reputation: 779
Quote:
Originally Posted by Griffis View Post
Hatred, ignorance, fear and bigotry is what it is. There ARE no other reasons to oppose same sex marriage. And you cannot provide any, so you fail.

And you can't nullify inclusion and equality by claiming something doesn't live up to your personal definition.

Welcome out of the Dark Ages.
Huh? The Laws of God and nature oppose homosexuality, PERIOD

To be SPECIFIC, it's wicked, perverted, vile and Filthy.

And all the EVIL (un) politically correctness agenda wil not and cannot change that fact.
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