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One of the greatest ironies and contradictions of the US experiment borne of rebellion is that you cannot establish an orderly, functional civilized society while also allocating unrestricted freedom to the individual to disobey societal norms and laws. It just doesn't work.
We don't allow people to run traffic lights, whether they own guys or not. If you do, you'll get pulled over and ticketed - possibly jailed, too.
We don't allow people to engage in vigilantism and murder anyone they choose with their weapon - only to use it in self defense.
We don't allow people to not show up at jury duty, to not pay taxes, to not refrain from abusing their spouses.
There are plenty of those that you as a member of society are subject to that are completely out of the realm of your own personal decision, and guns do not change that.
What does any of the above have to do with the second amendment guarantee of the right to keep and bear arms?
No one on this thread seems to mention the first half of the amendment -- that militia stuff. How is that interpreted by the sovereign types? You can't wish it away. And who will do the regulating?
Another low-information post. Well-regulated, in the parlance of the day, meant well provisioned, equipped or operating.
There is no such thing as a "sovereign citizen." No person can be above the law, for it is not the individual that is sovereign, it is the law. Get used to it.
[URL]//www.city-data.com/forum/25275103-post48.html[/URL]
The sovereign citizen is opposed to the sovereign crown as the owners of the country. In Europe, the crown owned the nation, and the people who were NOT citizens, but "subjects"
In America, the people, not the government, own the nation. It is called "freedom".
These right wing domestic terrorists are the greatest threat to our country today. They think they're above the law and that murdering cops and census workers some how makes them righteous. They're violent, delusional, and mentally unhinged.
Excuse me? What part of "shall not be infringed" do you not understand?
The "shall", the "not", the "be", or the "infringed"?
The part about a well regulated militia means, according to both the courts and any sane person, that regulations on firearms are not only allowed but constitutionally required.
Excuse me? What part of "shall not be infringed" do you not understand?
The "shall", the "not", the "be", or the "infringed"?
I understand it fully. the part where you ignore the "well regulated militia" portion of the 2nd Amendment. You know, where government CAN impose laws on who and who can't own a gun, and of course, the type of weapons one can own.
Sovereign citizens think it means much more (like having their own militia and that you can go murdering police officers because you own a gun)
The part about a well regulated militia means, according to both the courts and any sane person, that regulations on firearms are not only allowed but constitutionally required.
Wow, the sheer ignorance of your post is simply amazing.
The prefatory portion of the 2nd Amendment is much like the preamble to the Constitution itself. It doesnt confer any powers, it is a reason for the following content. In order for their to be a militia at all, the people MUST have the right to keep and bear arms.
Your assertion that regulations on firearms are required by the Constitution is not only incorrect, but it defies logic, history, common sense, and intellect.
Specifically what types of drugs have you consumed today? I only ask because large amounts of hallucinogenics or a traumatic brain injury would be required to come up with the very idea you posted.
Whether you gun haters like it or not, the 2nd Amendment confers an INDIVIDUAL right to keep and bear arms. It does not require membership in a militia in any manner, as the people themselves are the militia.
Isn't it funny that after the right wing crazies get pwnd they abandon their own thread?
No, it's typical. I wish some more of these "sovereign citizens" would test out their self proclaimed sovereignty so they can see how the federal government responds. Most of them are just the usual cliche keyboard warrior types though.
There or have been so-called sovereigns and then there are Sovereigns:
Actually, the so-called Sovereign that all of the negatives on the subject are not aware of would be that those miscreants that are claiming to be sovereign and doing harm are not legal sovereigns, "States Nationals". They are a people that have falsely laid claim to the title sovereign.
I know many Sovereigns (prefer to be known as Nationals) who are upstanding and patriotic American's. They at least, as compared to the negativism of claimed Sovereigns on this network know who their rightful nation is and it isn't the federal government that all negative responders no doubt relish in serving as federal slaves, serfs of the federal serfdom.
Yes, there are miscreants who classify themselves as Sovereigns but are not legally documented as such as the people that I know are. The biggest culprit in labeling the true Sovereign/National is the Southern Poverty Law Center and they are more pro-communist than American. Then there are the law enforcement agencies that disparage the Sovereign/National while not knowing a damn thing about their American history or the legal right that one has to claim sovereignty from the incorporation of the federal government and the incorporation of the State governments that have surrendered not only the States sovereignty over to the illegal federal government but the peoples sovereignty as well.
I wager that not one of you disparaging the Sovereign as a whole, and without regard for the legal Sovereign/National know what your true nation and nationality, let alone as an American, how many nationalities you have, one illegal and one legal nationality.
Not only that, I bet not one of you can say what the so-called Civil War's true title should be.
Want to talk about criminal Sovereigns, lumping the title into one basket? Well, lets talk also about the criminal cops who do not honor their oath which was nothing more than for most a formality in order to get the badge, or how about the criminal legislators and Congresspeople who also unabashedly violate their oath or criminal courts who think they can make law as that also goes for various agencies of the federal government who think they can make law. The BLM and ATF are two out of many who see themselves as being able to make law.
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The Sovereign Citizen and reality.
