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Old 03-04-2013, 02:22 PM
 
6,331 posts, read 4,863,435 times
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Liberals, do you see this as a great betrayal?



Daily Kos: Reuters: Great Betrayal Is In Play; Obama Puts Medicare and Soc Sec "Compromises" On Table
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Old 03-04-2013, 03:18 PM
 
25,058 posts, read 25,677,773 times
Reputation: 11728
I've said this before this made news, beware that Obama was going to betray you, yet the Obama groupies (luckily there's 1 or 2 on here that don't buy into Obama's rhetoric) thought that Obama was going to save them and everything because he's so liberal and loving. LOL, don't say I didn't warn ya!
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Old 03-04-2013, 03:28 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,886 posts, read 41,741,783 times
Reputation: 18456
I think they are speechless.

The TEA Party is working to actually change this nation back to the greatness it once was.
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Old 03-04-2013, 03:30 PM
 
Location: Old Town Alexandria
14,495 posts, read 25,210,629 times
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I dont believe anything I see or hear from any politician in America anymore, especially if its on CNN .
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Old 03-04-2013, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Pine Grove,AL
26,447 posts, read 13,786,568 times
Reputation: 5034
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Draper View Post
in 3 months time, conservatives will have labeled it as only a reduction in future spending by cutting cost and then when he brags about it, they will say it was a cut in benefits.
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Old 03-04-2013, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
14,371 posts, read 9,011,236 times
Reputation: 6651
Obama is a snake. He'll offer whatever is in play, and then after he gets what HE WANTS, he'll just forget about the concessions. It's no different then back in 82 when the Dems offered Reagan $3 in cuts for every dollar in revenue... sound familiar?

Obama just got $800B in hiked taxes; he wasn't sastified and it only took 2 months for him to start clammering for more. He thought he could strong arm Republicans into caving. He pushed one too many times.

Now maybe they'll actually start fixing it, instead of kicking it down the road.
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Old 03-04-2013, 05:51 PM
 
3,309 posts, read 3,417,176 times
Reputation: 1960
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Draper View Post
He's specifically putting means-tested medicare on the table because retirees who actually saved for retirement vote strongly Republican. It's a political move -- he's saying, well, you want cuts to entitlements, here I'm going to offer the one that would hurt my (Obama's) base the least and yours (Republican's) the most.

Now, he knows this won't fly, but, it lets him say "well I offered cuts to entitlement spending but they didn't take me up on it", which is technically true, and low information voters (and heck, high information voters who don't step back and think about it) won't realize what he's doing.
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Old 03-04-2013, 06:56 PM
 
Location: Ohio
23,193 posts, read 16,677,790 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Draper View Post
Liberals, do you see this as a great betrayal?
Is there any substance to this? I mean are there specifics?

You do understand that exactly $0 comes out of the General Fund for Social Security, right?

Social Security is entirely funded by the FICA payroll tax, so what part of the budget is Social Security?

No part.

So how can one possibly speak of budget cuts for Social Security, when Social Security is not part of the budget?

Now, Medicare is a different animal.

Medicare is funded by both monies from the HI (Medicare) Tax and from the General Fund. However, note that the reason Medicare has to be funded in part from the General Fund is due to the fact that Congress have repeatedly refused to implement any of the suggestions offered by the Medicare Trustees in their annual reports. So for the past 15 years or so, every Congress has either refused to increase the HI (Medicare) Tax or refused to implement the service/payment cuts.

What my data shows is that you can raise the HI (Medicare) Tax to the level recommended by the Medicare Trustees in their 2012 Annual Report without causing any harm to your economy over the short or long terms.

However, my data also shows that you cannot save Medicare over the long-term without a major overhaul of the Medicare system.

My recommendation would be to "go Euro" with Medicare.

You can do just like the Germans, the Brits, the Swedes, the Ioti, and everyone else does.....

"In the past 20 years, our overriding philosophy has been that the health system cannot spend more than its income." -- Franz Knieps German Minister of Health (2009)

Okay, so for calendar year 2012, the HI (Medicare) Tax generated $205,729,561,955.19 --- $205 Billion -- in revenues.

So that's all that you spend on health care for Medicare. In reality, the figure is slightly higher, because you do actually generate interest off of the tiny bit left in the HI (Medicare) Trust Fund -- which will go belly up in about 4 years -- and you do collect monies from means-testing Social Security benefits --- that would be the "Taxation of Income" thing.

Like in the Euro-States, when you spend up the $205+ Billion, that's it....Game Over....no more money to be spent on health care for that year.

To resolve that problem, this is what the Germans have done...

"Virtual budgets are also set up at the regional levels; these ensure that all participants in the system—including the health insurance funds and providers— know from the beginning of the year onward how much money can be spent". -- Franz Knieps German Minister of Health (2009)

The Germans use virtual budgets to plan their health care spending for the year, to try and stretch those limited tax dollars as far as they possible can.

To do that, Germany, like Britain and Sweden and Canada deny health care to people, or they delay health care treatment, or they dilute the health care to the put of being ineffective.

So, like Alzheimer's patients, uh, you can't cure Alzheimer's, so spending money on medication -- even if it is nothing but generic drugs like Europe and Canada use --- is totally stupid and pointless. You provide only palliative care until they die (which hopefully is very quickly so they don't suck up too much tax money for health care).

I'm guessing the NAZIs will be out in full force and the propaganda and disinformation running thick and heavy on Social Security and Medicare.

Seeing...

Mircea
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Old 03-04-2013, 07:24 PM
 
8,147 posts, read 4,415,412 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post




So, like Alzheimer's patients, uh, you can't cure Alzheimer's, so spending money on medication -- even if it is nothing but generic drugs like Europe and Canada use --- is totally stupid and pointless. You provide only palliative care until they die (which hopefully is very quickly so they don't suck up too much tax money for health care).


Mircea
Well I guess it isn't terribly cost effective to attempt to develope effective treatments and maybe a cure for Alzheimer's. You'd have to keep some of them around just to study.
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Old 03-04-2013, 07:26 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
7,214 posts, read 8,735,654 times
Reputation: 7776
We have heard this same speculation every 2-3 months and then nothing ever comes of it.
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