The state of the American man (cocaine, Chicago, government, support)
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Basically it's easy to judge these guys and be an internet tough guy from the comfort of your own home, but imagine one second you're sitting there kicking back beers after a tough shift and the next thing a big, extremely drunk undercover Chicago cop is wailing on a bartender. Get involved and not only are you going to probably get your ass beat by a guy who's obviously done stuff like this before, but his cop buddies will then pin a felony on you. Assaulting a police officer, etc. etc.
It's easy to say what you would and would not do from the comfort of your home. But I'm honest about my identity (click the (i) and you will get everything) and my location. Because of that I do get death threats on a regular basis because what I say is controversial. One person even called the cops and had the ATF harass the apartment managers about me. Whatever I do, I don't shield myself from comfort but embrace the consequences.
I would say as best as I can from the comfort of my home that I would shoot this cop dead if I saw this display. If I didn't have a gun, I'd at least restrain him. I'm much bigger than the cop by his appearance. I'm above 6'6" and over 260 lbs and unlike him I'm not fat. But yes what I'm saying is from the comfort of my own home.
In Chechnya, women are beaten all the time by their husbands and sometimes fathers. But if the situation like this were to develop. Where a drunken stranger began beating a woman, one of them would pull out a gun and shoot him dead.
Let's see if you're smart enough to see the difference. I'm not "highlighting" the cops actions but rather the inaction of the bystanders.
I know what you are doing, but you fail to realize again that the very kind of manhood that you promote produces the type of men who are most likely to beat women.
Very authoritarian male dominated societies have very high levels of women getting beaten.
So if you have a problem with women getting beaten, then you want to get as far away from promoting authoritarian male dominated societies.
I know that you don't care about a woman getting beaten. You care about men being afraid to be violent, which of course the more men who are willing to be violent the more women that will be beaten.
You'll probably see it where you look for it. One incident doesn't make a trend, just an observation, regardless of the country or participant nationality.
You can't deny differences across countries. Yes, there is weakness everywhere. But it's more common in the west, and I doubt I'm hallucinating it.
I know what you are doing, but you fail to realize again that the very kind of manhood that you promote produces the type of men who are most likely to beat women.
Very authoritarian male dominated societies have very high levels of women getting beaten.
So if you have a problem with women getting beaten, then you want to get as far away from promoting authoritarian male dominated societies.
I know that you don't care about a woman getting beaten. You care about men being afraid to be violent, which of course the more men who are willing to be violent the more women that will be beaten.
If a woman deserves it, I have no problem with her being beaten. Just as I have no problem with men being beaten when they deserve it.
Here is the important point: she didn't deserve it. Everyone in the bar knew it. Everyone in the bar was angry. They wanted to do something. But they were too scared too. They were caged in by their own fears. 2 people could easily restrain that guy.
I care about men being men. I want to see them take responsibility. I want them to act when they see an injustice. Not just in a bar when a woman is being beaten by a drunk. But everywhere.
It's easy to say what you would and would not do from the comfort of your home. But I'm honest about my identity (click the (i) and you will get everything) and my location. Because of that I do get death threats on a regular basis because what I say is controversial. One person even called the cops and had the ATF harass the apartment managers about me. Whatever I do, I don't shield myself from comfort but embrace the consequences.
I would say as best as I can from the comfort of my home that I would shoot this cop dead if I saw this display. If I didn't have a gun, I'd at least restrain him. I'm much bigger than the cop by his appearance. I'm above 6'6" and over 260 lbs and unlike him I'm not fat. But yes what I'm saying is from the comfort of my own home.
Good for you. And if you knew he was a Chicago cop and your life was going to turn to **** for getting involved no matter how big you are? You obviously know nothing of this bar, this city, or the CPD. In fact, if the owner of Jesse's hadn't installed security cameras prior to the incident, the bartender would have been railroaded (the CPD's attempts to intimidate her and the bar's owner to hand over the video tape were a major factor in her lawsuit against the city). In the end, nobody died - nobody was really hurt actually since he never really landed a clean punch - and justice was served. He lost his job and did jail time; she's in great financial shape; and the CPD chief resigned.
Last edited by CaseyB; 03-07-2013 at 04:29 AM..
Reason: off topic
I care about this woman being beaten because she didn't deserve it. A woman who slaps her husband, cheats on her husband, or is otherwise malicious to her husband..if she gets beaten, I don't care and will leave myself out of it.
And in this case, the men not resorting to violence was detrimental. Sitting back and calling the police is not what men should do in this case.
Again, you are just restating what I have gotten you to admit that you are a very sick man.
You believe men not wanting to be violent is a problem for our society, and now you advocate that you are ok with husbands beating their cheating or malicious wives.
Again, you are just restating what I have gotten you to admit that you are a very sick man.
You believe men not wanting to be violent is a problem for our society, and now you advocate that you are ok with husbands beating their cheating or malicious wives.
conservatives hate.
If someone will not violently defend innocents then there is a breakdown of society. Men have stopped being men and have become children of the state. Only children are more violent and manly than the men in that video.
This is an old story. Back in November, 2012 the Chicago PD was found guilty of covering this up and the woman got almost 1 million dollars. The Chicago PD is appealing so this story continues.
Ignoring the off-duty cop who is beating the bartender, notice the 2 (and later 3 ) men just standing around. The one in, what appears blue hoody and cap, stands up, begins yelling, and dialing what probably is 911 but never bothers to help the woman as she is pummeled. The other man walks around the bar, also not helping the woman. The third guy, probably owner, seems to just yell at the man to leave but doesn't seem willing to do anything physical.
That's 3 men who afraid of getting into a physical altercation allowed this woman to be beaten up. I often hear on the internet that if "so-so hits a woman, he's dead" well not at all in this case.
But this is not just about retaliating when you see a weaker, defenseless person being beaten because you're too much of a coward of being hit. This is a whole list of troubling things that as I read and consume this POC, I'm beginning to be troubled by the American man.
1)such as supporting blindly female rights over male rights
2)Advocating cooperating with the police instead of being self sufficient
3)afraid of guns
4)supports nanny government (see urbanlife)
5)gets overly worked up over the values of other traditional countries (calling them backwards, or primitive)
6)Not able to differentiate when defending oneself is a moral imperative
etc
This is not so much an American man problem I guess, but a Western man problem. I saw it when I lived in the UK but I didn't see it when I lived in Russia. In Italy, it was intermediate but even there, there was some sanity.
So... you're using an example of three men not stopping an assault as a way to argue against women's rights? I'm fascinated by the connection you see between the two...
It's easy to say what you would and would not do from the comfort of your home. But I'm honest about my identity (click the (i) and you will get everything) and my location. Because of that I do get death threats on a regular basis because what I say is controversial. One person even called the cops and had the ATF harass the apartment managers about me. Whatever I do, I don't shield myself from comfort but embrace the consequences.
I would say as best as I can from the comfort of my home that I would shoot this cop dead if I saw this display. If I didn't have a gun, I'd at least restrain him. I'm much bigger than the cop by his appearance. I'm above 6'6" and over 260 lbs and unlike him I'm not fat. But yes what I'm saying is from the comfort of my own home.
Unfortunately, even with your size, you still can't stop a bullet.
So, you come in and beat the crap out of this guy. You assist the woman in need and make sure she's ok. You did the right and noble thing. However, the dude you just kicked the crap out of limps back with his gun and shoots you. Now what? Or, he waits for you outside and shoots you there? This stuff happens. Gone are the days where someone loses a fight and just says, "Well, I lost and will leave it at that". Long ago guys would fight and the winner and loser just left it at that. Now, it's all about egos and the need to win at all costs.
We also live in a very litigious society today. People are sued often for doing the right thing. Sad but true. I agree with you that men today are not the men of yesterday which is sad. You can't get into a fight and win or lose and then shake the other guys hand after and it's forgotten. You can't defend the honor of a victim without being thrown in court afterwards. Yeah, you didn't do anything wrong but now your life is turned upside down by being sued or have to go to court as a witness, etc. Your home and work life are now screwed and you didn't deserve it.
I'm not sure what I would have done in this situation. I hope I would have made an effort to stop it, but I would have clearly been outnumbered. Perhaps I get the guys attention whereas he at least stops hitting the poor woman. But yeah, I guess three guys there should have done something together.
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I'm fascinated by the connection you see between the two...
