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Old 03-26-2013, 10:10 PM
 
Location: 53179
14,416 posts, read 22,486,250 times
Reputation: 14479

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Which explains why some teens do heinous things because they were raised without good adult remodels.
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:55 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,481,831 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by glass_of_merlot View Post
Which explains why some teens do heinous things because they were raised without good adult remodels.
It's not just the teens(minors) themselves. Lots of gangs use minors to do their dirty work because the minors won't face stiff jail sentences.

Want to rob a house..send in that 12 year old and promise him some loot.
He gets caught..it's juvie. You get caught it's jail.

Adult criminals are making full use of the justice system and it's differences.
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Old 03-27-2013, 07:30 AM
 
78,409 posts, read 60,593,823 times
Reputation: 49691
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
I suspect there are drugs involved in some way. Drug money from the baby's insurance plan or something? I wouldn't be surprised if the two teen boys are actually innocent and that the adults are all guilty.
If you've followed the case at all you would know the boys were involved. You may be absolutely correct about the other stuff.
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Old 03-27-2013, 07:33 AM
 
78,409 posts, read 60,593,823 times
Reputation: 49691
Quote:
Originally Posted by WannaliveinGreenville View Post
BINGO! Too many Gerber Life Insurance commmercials on TV....and I have to ask, why would you have life insurance on a baby? Seriously?
Because you can drop 15k pretty easily on a funeral. Not to mention if they are injured and then dies you could have huge medical expenses and may need some time off work to recover, mental health care etc.

Not saying you need $500,000 on the baby but that's not the kind of limits they sell. 25k-50k I can totally see.

P.S. From personal experience an abulance ride from the hospital to hospice care cost me over $700 and isn't covered by insurance (non-emergency). Just an example of just one the various costs that can arise.
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Old 03-27-2013, 07:41 AM
 
Location: Maryland
18,630 posts, read 19,416,507 times
Reputation: 6462
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldhag1 View Post
I disagree with it too. Teenagers misbehave because developmentally they don't have the same emotional stability as adults, even the "good" ones. They don't comprehend consequences, for themselves or their victims, the way an adult can.
The court has already ruled. Laws that state automatic life without parole are unconstitutional. Judges can still sentence a juvenile to life without parole though but on a case by case basis.

While Im willing to concede that teens don't think like full grown adults. Somethings are known to be wrong no matter the age. Shooting someone is wrong. Most teens get through their teenage years without killing someone.

Life without parole is a perfectly justifiable punishment. I'm tired of libs trying to get kid killers off the hook.
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Old 03-27-2013, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
37,102 posts, read 41,261,487 times
Reputation: 45136
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/...7gcdYKWg%3D%3D

"The researchers later obtained juvenile and adult criminal records and found that teacher ratings of pupils' behaviors at ages 6 and 10 were associated with criminal convictions between the ages of 12 and 24.

Specifically, they found that boys aged 6 who were rated by their teachers as having the highest degree of conduct behavior problems and hurtful and uncaring behaviors were 4 times more likely to be convicted of violent crimes and 5 times more likely to be convicted of nonviolent crimes than boys with lower ratings."

In the section titled Reservations at the end of the article, one child psychiatrist questions the study, particularly the validity of the teachers' observations. However, the study was done prospectively. It's not as if the teachers heard about a child's criminal behavior and then said they knew when he was 6 that he would grow up that way.

The study says nothing about the causes of the behaviors in the 6 and 10 year old kids. Socioeconomic factors are a part of it, but not the entire story.

This is a Power Point presentation for professionals. On one of the slides, it notes that racial differences in sociopathy disappear when education and socioeconomic status are controlled for. It does not give the source for the information, but it is just PPT, not a study itself.

http://www.med.uvm.edu/ahec/download...oundsJan10.pdf

If children who will become violent criminals can be identified, we cannot afford not to identify them and attempt to treat them and modify their behavior.

I know a psychiatrist that tells psychopaths they will always be wolves, but they live in a society of dogs, and unless they wish to be placed in a cage like a wolf in a zoo, they need to learn to pretend they are dogs.

As information on De’Marquise Elkins comes out, it is likely that we will find a history of behaviors like those that the study in the first article found to be predictive of violent behavior. We also already have reports of socioeconomic factors associated with sociopathy, including the fact that his mother has criminal conviction for assault when she was 18. Black race happens to not be one of those factors. All of us would prefer that no one would be capable of committing this crime. It did happen, though, and right now everything points to Elkins and nothing supports the idea that either of the child's parents were involved. If Elkins did it, it's because he is a sociopath, not because he is black.

The Brunswick Chief of Police, Tobe Green, is black, experienced, and serves a predominantly black community. Some members of that community are cooperating in the investigation, which is the reason a gun has been found. If there is more to this than what has so far appeared in the news, I am sure Chief Green is motivated to find it out.
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:43 AM
 
Location: Suffolk, Va
3,027 posts, read 2,520,187 times
Reputation: 1964
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Because you can drop 15k pretty easily on a funeral. Not to mention if they are injured and then dies you could have huge medical expenses and may need some time off work to recover, mental health care etc.

Not saying you need $500,000 on the baby but that's not the kind of limits they sell. 25k-50k I can totally see.

P.S. From personal experience an abulance ride from the hospital to hospice care cost me over $700 and isn't covered by insurance (non-emergency). Just an example of just one the various costs that can arise.
If she had the baby cremated, as has been rumored, then the funeral costs would be far less.
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Old 03-27-2013, 12:13 PM
 
3,436 posts, read 2,948,991 times
Reputation: 1787
Quote:
Originally Posted by Californian34 View Post
If she had the baby cremated, as has been rumored, then the funeral costs would be far less.

I don't think she even had a memorial service. Maybe it's just something that hasn't been reported...I guess it's going to take while for all the details to come out.
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Old 03-27-2013, 12:17 PM
 
73,012 posts, read 62,607,656 times
Reputation: 21929
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/...7gcdYKWg%3D%3D

"The researchers later obtained juvenile and adult criminal records and found that teacher ratings of pupils' behaviors at ages 6 and 10 were associated with criminal convictions between the ages of 12 and 24.

Specifically, they found that boys aged 6 who were rated by their teachers as having the highest degree of conduct behavior problems and hurtful and uncaring behaviors were 4 times more likely to be convicted of violent crimes and 5 times more likely to be convicted of nonviolent crimes than boys with lower ratings."

In the section titled Reservations at the end of the article, one child psychiatrist questions the study, particularly the validity of the teachers' observations. However, the study was done prospectively. It's not as if the teachers heard about a child's criminal behavior and then said they knew when he was 6 that he would grow up that way.

The study says nothing about the causes of the behaviors in the 6 and 10 year old kids. Socioeconomic factors are a part of it, but not the entire story.

This is a Power Point presentation for professionals. On one of the slides, it notes that racial differences in sociopathy disappear when education and socioeconomic status are controlled for. It does not give the source for the information, but it is just PPT, not a study itself.

http://www.med.uvm.edu/ahec/download...oundsJan10.pdf

If children who will become violent criminals can be identified, we cannot afford not to identify them and attempt to treat them and modify their behavior.

I know a psychiatrist that tells psychopaths they will always be wolves, but they live in a society of dogs, and unless they wish to be placed in a cage like a wolf in a zoo, they need to learn to pretend they are dogs.

As information on De’Marquise Elkins comes out, it is likely that we will find a history of behaviors like those that the study in the first article found to be predictive of violent behavior. We also already have reports of socioeconomic factors associated with sociopathy, including the fact that his mother has criminal conviction for assault when she was 18. Black race happens to not be one of those factors. All of us would prefer that no one would be capable of committing this crime. It did happen, though, and right now everything points to Elkins and nothing supports the idea that either of the child's parents were involved. If Elkins did it, it's because he is a sociopath, not because he is black.

The Brunswick Chief of Police, Tobe Green, is black, experienced, and serves a predominantly black community. Some members of that community are cooperating in the investigation, which is the reason a gun has been found. If there is more to this than what has so far appeared in the news, I am sure Chief Green is motivated to find it out.
The powerpoint had some interesting information. There is more to this issue than meets the eye.
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Old 03-27-2013, 01:16 PM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
20,126 posts, read 16,157,110 times
Reputation: 28335
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
"The researchers later obtained juvenile and adult criminal records and found that teacher ratings of pupils' behaviors at ages 6 and 10 were associated with criminal convictions between the ages of 12 and 24.

Specifically, they found that boys aged 6 who were rated by their teachers as having the highest degree of conduct behavior problems and hurtful and uncaring behaviors were 4 times more likely to be convicted of violent crimes and 5 times more likely to be convicted of nonviolent crimes than boys with lower ratings."
As a teacher with over 20 years experience, I have never been surprised to find out a particular kid ran afoul of the law later. However, some that I was concerned about got their act together at some point. So you just never know. Every so often, though, you run into one that you, and everybody that encounters the kid, knows will end up being a sociopath, but they are rare. They are also scary, and I kid you not, make the hairs on the back of your neck stand up. All you can do is spend that year doing everything you can to shelter the other kids from the little Satan's spawn as much as you are capable of, and constantly remind yourself that it is just a child. I have never been wrong about one of those. That I know of, one got sent to death row six years ago, four were charged as adults for a violent crime before they even got out of high school, and one had her third child taken by the state before she was twenty. Does make you wish you could address them proactively but we don't lock up people on their potential to do harm.
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