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I live in California now, and it's a mess, but it's finally moving ahead. The reason why is because democrats don't have to worry about a minority of republicans who refuse to compromise on a tax increase; they've been effectively voted out by constituents who started seeing through their antics.
You mention taxes. I can agree that California has high taxation rates, but a major part of the problem is that proposition thirteen has lowered the amount of taxes that California receives from property taxes. Moreover, the proportion that California does receive from property taxes is uneven, shifting the burden away from people who've held their property for years to those who have recently purchased homes. I pay more property taxes than the previous homeowner (who held this house for 40 years) did -- like about five times more.
The tax structure hasn't been able to keep up with changes in the state's population. Another result of this uneven tax code is that the state has had to make up the money through fees. I and we all have to pay ridiculous fees to register our cars every freaking year. Local cities get less support from the state so they raise local taxes. You and I would probably agree that illegal immigration is a significant factor here, but even so, the state should be flexible enough to adapt. Prop 13 didn't allow for such flexibility and the republicans in the government didn't, either.
The democrats in the state have wanted to address this problem for years - republicans objected and were forced to sign a no-compromise pledge in order to receive their base support to get re-elected (sounds familiar, dunnit?). I think that's why a lot of people - even businesses - are optimistic that Brown is going to get things done, even if they don't always share his philosophy over the role of the state's involvement in the economy.
Hahaha..........and Dems shriek that conservatives hate old people. Do you realize Prop 13 was created to make sure that folks that had owned their homes for decades could continue to live there without the fear of losing it because of high taxes?
All of you "repeal Prop 13" folks - what should be done about that? If all of a sudden the taxes are raised on homes that are VERY expensive, and the folks (many of them elderly) that live there are hit with tax bills FAR higher than they ever dreamed, what should the state do if they don't pay? Kick them out on their rears? Or do you not care, as long as someone else has to pay the same amount as you do?
You bought your home knowing what the tax rate is. Complaining about it now makes you a hypocrite.
Last edited by ringwise; 04-01-2013 at 08:42 AM..
Reason: typo
Ah, the sheeple. They don't see that this so-called real estate "rebound" is a manipulated attempt to raise property tax revenues to get money for the state. With thousands poised to be laid off because of ObamaCare and more and more businesses leaving the state, that giant popping sound will be the bubble bursting again.
Just talked to my MIL yesterday. She's in the mortgage business. There are no new loans being taken out. Lots of refi's (again). The inventory is just not there, which is creating a false increase in prices. Once folks start trying to unload their homes, it'll be another disaster.
Yeah, all the real estate agents are in cahoots with the state to raise tax revenue. Sure.
Needless to say, the usual suspects are still predicting doom — this time from the very tax hikes that are closing the budget gap, which they say will cause millionaires and businesses to flee the state. Well, maybe — but serious studies have found very little evidence either that tax hikes cause lots of wealthy people to move or that state taxes have any significant impact on growth.
Hahaha..........and Dems shriek that conservatives hate old people. Do you realize Prop 13 was created to make sure that folks that had owned their homes for decades could continue to live there without the fear of losing it because of high taxes?
All of you "repeal Prop 13" folks - what should be done about that? If all of a sudden the taxes are raised on homes that are VERY expensive, and the folks (many of them elderly) that live there are hit with tax bills FAR higher than they ever dreamed, what should the state do if they don't pay? Kick them out on their rears? Or do you not care, as long as someone else has to pay the same amount as you do?
You bought your home knowing what the tax rate is. Complaining about it now makes you a hypocrite.
What Prop 13 did was provided a disincentive to sell a home instead of selling it to someone else. Thus, the little old lady whose children have moved away stays in a big house because taxes would be higher to move to a smaller one and free that big house for a new family.
Moreover, it contributes to unfair taxation, since taxes are based on sale date. So, I mansion left unsold would have lower taxes than a common home sold recently.
The net effect was to starve localities of revenue, primarily schools, which once were the best in the nation.
What Prop 13 did was provided a disincentive to sell a home instead of selling it to someone else. Thus, the little old lady whose children have moved away stays in a big house because taxes would be higher to move to a smaller one and free that big house for a new family.
Moreover, it contributes to unfair taxation, since taxes are based on sale date. So, I mansion left unsold would have lower taxes than a common home sold recently.
The net effect was to starve localities of revenue, primarily schools, which once were the best in the nation.
No, under Prop 13 property taxes still increase. For the last ten years my taxes have increased (2% a year) at a rate that exceeds inflation. How are they starving?
What Prop 13 did was provided a disincentive to sell a home instead of selling it to someone else. Thus, the little old lady whose children have moved away stays in a big house because taxes would be higher to move to a smaller one and free that big house for a new family.
Moreover, it contributes to unfair taxation, since taxes are based on sale date. So, I mansion left unsold would have lower taxes than a common home sold recently.
The net effect was to starve localities of revenue, primarily schools, which once were the best in the nation.
Not true... there are subsequent voter approved Props that allow seniors to sell the mansion and downsize...
This is part of the Problem is too many people have no idea how Prop 13 and the related Props work...
Date of Sale is a double edge sword... I bought during the peak pre-bubble and those that came after me were buying at 25 to 30% less than I paid...
Prop 13 is nothing more than a tax based of value at the time of acquisition with a built-in annual inflation adjustment... it also requires voter approval for new assessments and the voters lowered this for schools..
I was not old enough to have voted for Prop 13 when it became law... I am thankful each and every day it did!
What do real estate agents have to do with anything? They only sell homes that are available for sale. Look instead to lending institutions, who are hanging on to foreclosed homes, or denying short sales, which has created a shortage of homes. And yes, I do think they could be "in cahoots".
You can hope that CA is rebounding, but the reality is that is is FAR from coming back. Will it someday? Most likely. Will it be painful in the meantime? Absolutely. I take no pleasure in seeing this reality. But I also don't bury my head in the sand about the state of that state. I lived there too long, seeing the politicians "predicting" a budget surplus every year, only to have it be revised to a deficit. Or worse, if there was a surplus, see it used for political payback and spent with no regard for the future.
What Prop 13 did was provided a disincentive to sell a home instead of selling it to someone else. Thus, the little old lady whose children have moved away stays in a big house because taxes would be higher to move to a smaller one and free that big house for a new family.
Moreover, it contributes to unfair taxation, since taxes are based on sale date. So, I mansion left unsold would have lower taxes than a common home sold recently.
The net effect was to starve localities of revenue, primarily schools, which once were the best in the nation.
If you don't know what you're talking about, you really should stay out of it. Look up Prop 90. It deals with this exact situation. A senior citizen can move to another home, that costs more, and take their tax bill with them.
Again, proving that not only are Dems ignorant, but they hate senior citizens. You want that person to move out of their lifelong home, just because a new family "needs" that home? All taxation is unfair, but I notice you don't discuss the unfair taxation on folks over a certain income.
There is plenty of revenue for schools. Remember how the lottery was supposed to go to the schools? Well, it did. And the politicians took away money from the schools, equal to what they were getting from the lottery, so nothing changed. You think that wouldn't happen again?
No, under Prop 13 property taxes still increase. For the last ten years my taxes have increased (2% a year) at a rate that exceeds inflation. How are they starving?
The annual rate of inflation over the last 40 years has been 4%.
The disparity grows when property prices appreciate by more than 2% a year. The Case-Shiller housing index shows prices in Los Angeles, San Diego, and San Francisco appreciated 170% from 1987 (start of available data) to 2012 while the 2% cap only allowed a 67% increase during this 26-year period. S&P | S&P/Case-Shiller Home Price Indices | Americas
As long as the rich people stay in CA and pay higher taxes, then sure CA has a bright future.
But CA needs to know where to draw the line because the Fed wants some of that money from the rich people as well.
Pinning your hopes for a surplus on rising taxes is not a good long term plan.
Rich people move to California all the time despite the right wing talking point just like Mitt Romney moved here despite bashing the state to the tards in the last election. BTW no taxes are not "rising" they restored tax rates which had been cut in the last 20 years and it was only a partial restoration so they're still lower than the 1990's and there are no plans to raise them again. The key thing is they dealt with the problem in a mature and rational manner by both cutting spending and raising taxes so that people could still get the services they wanted from the state and, yes, that is a good thing for the future of the state.
The disparity grows when property prices appreciate by more than 2% a year. The Case-Shiller housing index shows prices in Los Angeles, San Diego, and San Francisco appreciated 170% from 1987 (start of available data) to 2012 while the 2% cap only allowed a 67% increase during this 26-year period. S&P | S&P/Case-Shiller Home Price Indices | Americas
Prop 13 adds voter input and stability to property taxes in California...
Prop 13 is based on Value at the time of acquisition... this is not a hard concept to understand.
Just because some were drinking the kool aid during the Real Estate Bubble and paid outrageous prices... thank goodness for prop 13 protecting those that didn't engage in wild speculation...
You do realize without Prop 13... property taxes would return to the system of being taxed on the Assessor's opinion of value... we tried this and it didn't work... not to mention the cases of corruption when Assessors gave friends and those of influence sweetheart deals... some Assessors went to prisons and others committed suicide based on the old system of Opinion of Value.
Prop 13 works and it works well.
Prop 13 applies equally to each and every assessable property in the State.
Prop 13 is based on fair market value at the time of transfer...
Prop 13 in it's entirely is only a few short paragraphs... simply enough for anyone to understand.
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