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Old 04-08-2013, 04:09 PM
 
Location: Arizona
13,604 posts, read 8,548,000 times
Reputation: 7370

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As long as there have been pro-2nd amendment and anti-gunners facing off over current and proposed gun laws one thing has remained a constant. That is that the NRA and all pro-gunners have adopted the mantra that "guns don't kill people, people do."
As an avid gun collector, target shooter and combat veteran I have come to the conclusion that the NRA and pro second faction are correct. It's the people who do the killing, and it doesn't matter what weapon they use, except that guns kill more people much faster and in greater numbers than other forms of weapons.

So what's the answer? I think I've found one that both sides of the debate could agree on if they thought about it. It's a novel approach and shouldn't be rejected out of hand.

The solution to real change is to leave the guns alone. No new gun laws, all existing guns and magazines that are legal now will remain so. No new laws that only law abiding citizens will obey and no new restrictions.

But...........A federal law requiring a license to own a firearm would be required prior to any individual owning or purchasing a gun. This license would be retro-active and all current owners of any firearms regardless of caliber, size or capacity would be required to get this license. An applicant for this license would be required to pass a background check, a mental capacity check, a safety course and a legal responsibility course prior to qualifying for this license.
As I frequent this board, some various gun boards and various shooting ranges around my area I know of current gun owners who definitely should not allowed to handle or own a firearm based on their actions at the range and rabid posts on the various boards. No need to restrict private sales. If I sell a gun in a private sale, all I need is to see your weapons license and you're good to go.

Gun advocates and the NRA should jump on this proposal as back in the old days when I was growing up the NRA was very instrumental in conducting safety and qualification classes around the country to high school aged kids who wanted to take up the shooting sports. Now all they do is petition for money. Anti-gunners should also jump on this as it knocks the legs out of all the arguments offered by the pro gunners concerning type, capacity and caliber of firearm restrictions. No registration of guns, no restrictions on what guns to own or where you can own them. Just get your license and you can own any damn gun you want.
It should be emphasized that no guns would be registered under this licensing law so the ever present fear of registration and future confiscation would not be an issue.
Based on the threads and comments from pro-gun posters, identifying those individuals who are not mentally fit, properly trained and adequately informed of the responsibilities that go hand in hand with gun ownership would be a positive priority for them and the NRA. The NRA should love the licensing proposal as it leaves the guns alone. They even could be the in-place organization that conducts the safety and responsibility training required to obtain a license.

What is the overall consensus on this proposal? I'm very interested in both sides of the issue and what their thoughts are.
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Old 04-08-2013, 04:21 PM
 
12,201 posts, read 11,538,247 times
Reputation: 4920
Yes i agree it is the people. Had this deputy been more observant his wife would still be here.

Happened in SECONDS!

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/b...6#.UWMuOUo09WU


Boy, 4, Accidentally Kills Tenn. Deputy's Wife


By SHEILA BURKE Associated Press
NASHVILLE, Tenn. April 8, 2013 (AP)

Authorities say a 4-year-old boy got ahold of a loaded gun at a family cookout and shot and killed the wife of a Tennessee sheriff's deputy.

Investigators say Wilson County Deputy Daniel Fanning on Saturday was showing his weapons to a relative in a bedroom of his Lebanon home when the toddler came in and picked up a gun off the bed. Sheriff Robert Bryan says the weapon discharged, hitting 48-year-old Josephine Fanning.

She was pronounced dead at the scene. The child is not related to her or her husband.

Bryan says the shooting was a terrible accident and that within seconds of Fanning placing the gun on the bed, the toddler picked it up.

The gun was not Fanning's service weapon and the sheriff says the deputy's weapons are normally stored in a safe.
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Old 04-08-2013, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Texas
1,922 posts, read 2,503,552 times
Reputation: 949
Quote:
Originally Posted by mohawkx View Post
It's the people who do the killing, and it doesn't matter what weapon they use, except that guns kill more people much faster and in greater numbers than other forms of weapons.
Actually, I have to disagree. One person with a firearm is actually a fairly inefficient method of mass murder. It is simply a weapon of convenience, which is why it is used.

For instance:
September 11 - 2,976 people murdered, no firearms used
Oklahoma City Bombing - 168 people murdered, no firearms used
Bath School disaster/bombing - 45 killed, no firearm deaths
Wall Street bombing (1920) - 38 killed, no firearms used

It's no accident that the worst mass murders haven't involved a firearm at all.
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Old 04-08-2013, 04:49 PM
 
33,415 posts, read 29,661,705 times
Reputation: 19929
Quote:
Originally Posted by mohawkx View Post
As long as there have been pro-2nd amendment and anti-gunners facing off over current and proposed gun laws one thing has remained a constant. That is that the NRA and all pro-gunners have adopted the mantra that "guns don't kill people, people do."
As an avid gun collector, target shooter and combat veteran I have come to the conclusion that the NRA and pro second faction are correct. It's the people who do the killing, and it doesn't matter what weapon they use, except that guns kill more people much faster and in greater numbers than other forms of weapons.

So what's the answer? I think I've found one that both sides of the debate could agree on if they thought about it. It's a novel approach and shouldn't be rejected out of hand.

The solution to real change is to leave the guns alone. No new gun laws, all existing guns and magazines that are legal now will remain so. No new laws that only law abiding citizens will obey and no new restrictions.

But...........A federal law requiring a license to own a firearm would be required prior to any individual owning or purchasing a gun. This license would be retro-active and all current owners of any firearms regardless of caliber, size or capacity would be required to get this license. An applicant for this license would be required to pass a background check, a mental capacity check, a safety course and a legal responsibility course prior to qualifying for this license.
As I frequent this board, some various gun boards and various shooting ranges around my area I know of current gun owners who definitely should not allowed to handle or own a firearm based on their actions at the range and rabid posts on the various boards. No need to restrict private sales. If I sell a gun in a private sale, all I need is to see your weapons license and you're good to go.

Gun advocates and the NRA should jump on this proposal as back in the old days when I was growing up the NRA was very instrumental in conducting safety and qualification classes around the country to high school aged kids who wanted to take up the shooting sports. Now all they do is petition for money. Anti-gunners should also jump on this as it knocks the legs out of all the arguments offered by the pro gunners concerning type, capacity and caliber of firearm restrictions. No registration of guns, no restrictions on what guns to own or where you can own them. Just get your license and you can own any damn gun you want.
It should be emphasized that no guns would be registered under this licensing law so the ever present fear of registration and future confiscation would not be an issue.
Based on the threads and comments from pro-gun posters, identifying those individuals who are not mentally fit, properly trained and adequately informed of the responsibilities that go hand in hand with gun ownership would be a positive priority for them and the NRA. The NRA should love the licensing proposal as it leaves the guns alone. They even could be the in-place organization that conducts the safety and responsibility training required to obtain a license.

What is the overall consensus on this proposal? I'm very interested in both sides of the issue and what their thoughts are.
the only problem with your idea is that it becomes a defacto gun registration scheme. meaning that while firearms themselves may not be registered, the government will now know for sure who has firearms as they will have to have a federal license. and that my friend is illegal according to federal law.
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Old 04-08-2013, 05:30 PM
 
Location: MS
4,396 posts, read 4,393,055 times
Reputation: 1555
Quote:
Originally Posted by mohawkx View Post
....
So what's the answer? I think I've found one that both sides of the debate could agree on if they thought about it. It's a novel approach and shouldn't be rejected out of hand.

......
I thought about it and I don't agree. Try pitching this at a site like AR15.com and see what you get as a response. They don't have a filter to censor language there and people will definitely provide you with their true feelings.
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Old 04-20-2013, 02:56 PM
 
6,822 posts, read 5,656,152 times
Reputation: 3751
Default Guns don't kill people, people kill people

So think about what is THE dynamic that has changed with this nation along with the increased statistics of murders, rapes, child kidnappings, over the past couple decades.

According to the Word, there is no knowledge without God. He is the absolute reality and His Law should govern the nation. It used to. It's historic fact that this country was founded on Christian values. These values are engrained on our constitution.

Bottom line is it is not the gun, but it is the SIN. So you take away the gun. You still have the hate. So they use a knife now. According to Jesus, if someone hates another they've already committed murder in their heart. The issue is the spirit of Man.

You don't have to look any further for your answer for these awful deeds people are doing to each other. Look to the spirit of man that needs reconciliation with God in forgiveness of sins through Jesus Christ's sacrifice putting their hope in the resurrection - the living hope for all Mankind.

Repent toward GOD accepting Christ, start learning what He's telling us in His word in his we are to treat one another, and teach your children about Him. Stop letting them use you tax dollars to indoctrinate your children into evolution theology so they stop thinking there is no purpose or hope and that they are really only some highly evolved random accident.

Thus whole nation is in rebellion against Him and His ways and we are getting to see the fruit of what happens when nations forget God.

So are the guns really the issue? Or is it the heart? The spirit of Man?

Jesus Christ not only delivers from the penalty of sin but the power of sin by His spirit.
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Old 04-20-2013, 03:37 PM
 
24,326 posts, read 11,710,403 times
Reputation: 6903
There is no god. None whatsoever. :-)

There might be Jesus but like every nut job before and after him, they all claim to be messenger or son of god.
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Old 04-20-2013, 03:47 PM
 
Location: Imaginary Figment
11,456 posts, read 13,339,304 times
Reputation: 4773
Jesus loves guns, any Republican will tell you that.
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Old 04-20-2013, 04:23 PM
 
Location: Billings, MT
9,870 posts, read 9,064,549 times
Reputation: 14041
So, mike, let's have some specifics...
You are obviously a Bible believing evangelical Christian, and apparently aware of The Great Commission, but what brand of Christian are you?
Catholic?
Baptist? (which kind?)
Anglican?
Presbyterian?
Methodist?
Lutheran?

Oh, and lifeexplorer? PROVE IT!
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Old 04-20-2013, 04:26 PM
 
Location: NW Arkansas
1,201 posts, read 1,770,277 times
Reputation: 979
I know of no historic facts that this country was founded on Christian principles. Our country was founded by principles of the English enlightenment. The whole point of everything they did/proposed (people who led the enlightenment and the founding of this country) was to use reason over faith or religion.
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