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Old 05-07-2013, 01:41 PM
 
Location: Michigan
12,711 posts, read 13,456,579 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dubyanumberone View Post
Eminem is arguably the most popular and influential hip hop artist of all time and he's white.
Popular? Maybe. Influential? He only influences me to gag.
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Old 05-07-2013, 04:42 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 36,978,939 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
Yes, but you're dismissing the fact that in the earliest years of rock, when it was as underground music and played at the end of the radio dial on "race record" stations, it was VERY MUCH considered to be black music. That's because it most certainly was.

Fast forward 10-15 years...early 60's, British Invasion. At this point, it was certainly not "race music" anymore. British blues bands were regurgitating sounds that had been right here in America for 60 years if not longer. The big question remains as to why British bands had adopted a sound that white American bands had overlooked for decades.
And that is the gist of the problem because for the majority of Americans when the blues came back from England on the rebound, white Americans didn't know where it had come from in the first place. How many white kids knew that the "Time is On My Side" didn't spring from the mind of Mick Jagger but was originally sung by Irma Thomas, that "Piece of My Heart" wasn't a creation of Janis Joplin but Erma Franklin, that the Allman Brothers "Statesboro blues goes back to 1928 and Willie McTell's, or that the Hot Chilli Peppers' “They’re Red Hot” was actually Robert Johnson's, or that the Door's Back Door Man was Howlin' Wolf not to be confused with Wolf Man Jack?

Yes, everybody knows about Hendrix and that Hendrix was a black guy, but how many really understand the impact of American blues on Rock and Roll and the contribution of a whole lot more than a handful of African Americans created that music.
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Old 05-07-2013, 04:46 PM
 
5,705 posts, read 3,661,659 times
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Everyone knows that blacks folks were the originators of rock n roll. It's just that some people prefer to repress such thoughts by inbreeding more.
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Old 05-07-2013, 05:25 PM
 
56,989 posts, read 35,122,003 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
And that is the gist of the problem because for the majority of Americans when the blues came back from England on the rebound, white Americans didn't know where it had come from in the first place. How many white kids knew that the "Time is On My Side" didn't spring from the mind of Mick Jagger but was originally sung by Irma Thomas, that "Piece of My Heart" wasn't a creation of Janis Joplin but Erma Franklin, that the Allman Brothers "Statesboro blues goes back to 1928 and Willie McTell's, or that the Hot Chilli Peppers' “They’re Red Hot” was actually Robert Johnson's, or that the Door's Back Door Man was Howlin' Wolf not to be confused with Wolf Man Jack?

Yes, everybody knows about Hendrix and that Hendrix was a black guy, but how many really understand the impact of American blues on Rock and Roll and the contribution of a whole lot more than a handful of African Americans created that music.
Absolutely!

Frank Zappa clued me in when he told a story about first hearing Elvis. He recounted laughing his ass off at people thinking it was a novelty since he'd he'd been tuning in to race record stations from the moment he could turn on a radio.

Of course ...Zappa was hip. Most of America was lame.

And it breaks my heart that Bonnie Raitt had to basically beg Irma Thomas to put that song back in her repertoire. Shed stop singing it after tiring of audience members telling her after shows how well she had covered a Rolling Stones tune.
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Old 05-07-2013, 05:33 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
1,166 posts, read 1,511,170 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MetalLord View Post
Oh, and I forgot to add. All the thrash/death/black/whatever metal, not to mention hardcore itself (oldschool or otherwise), which all seems to be as 'non-black' as rock-and-roll can possibly be, simply would not exist as we know it were it not for the Bad Brains.

A bunch of jazz fusion musicians from the 'blackburbs' of D.C. were exposed to a Ramones record one day and were told that it was the fastest rock and roll band ever. They looked at each other and said "we can outdo that." The Ramones brought back the 3 minute rock song. The Bad Brains invented the 90 second thrash song, and the crazy part is, they even managed to do it with soul.
True stuff Not to mention one of the most popular and influential Death Metal musicians is black (from Suffocation) The Japanese had and continue to have a big influence on hardcore and metal as well!

Blacks have made a huge impact on the music of America; there is no doubt about that. Others have, of course, influenced our music as well to a large extent. We are very multi-cultural, after all. Miles Davis' biggest record, Kind of Blue, would not have been possible without Bill Evans and his influence from Debussy and the classical impressionists. Also, Gil Evans. However, Miles was also influenced in this era by a black pianist, Ahmad Jamal, so it went both way. Miles never cared much about skin color in music, as long as you could play.
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Old 05-07-2013, 06:38 PM
 
Location: in my imagination
13,584 posts, read 21,358,138 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
And that is the gist of the problem because for the majority of Americans when the blues came back from England on the rebound, white Americans didn't know where it had come from in the first place. How many white kids knew that the "Time is On My Side" didn't spring from the mind of Mick Jagger but was originally sung by Irma Thomas, that "Piece of My Heart" wasn't a creation of Janis Joplin but Erma Franklin, that the Allman Brothers "Statesboro blues goes back to 1928 and Willie McTell's, or that the Hot Chilli Peppers' “They’re Red Hot” was actually Robert Johnson's, or that the Door's Back Door Man was Howlin' Wolf not to be confused with Wolf Man Jack?

Yes, everybody knows about Hendrix and that Hendrix was a black guy, but how many really understand the impact of American blues on Rock and Roll and the contribution of a whole lot more than a handful of African Americans created that music.
Not a intentional racial thing though, just ignorance because most of us are tuned in to a limited scope, some people being just tuned in to their local station and like a song they hear but never give it any thought beyond.

I didn't know for a long time that "All along the watchtower" as a Dylan song, I thought it was a original Hendrix song. I didn't know for a long time that "Call me the breeze" was a JJ Cale song, I thought it was a original by Lynyrd Skynard.

Quite a few Led Zeppelin songs are covers they did by both black and white artists but Led Zep claimed mainstream fame to them.

Many kids today will think this song "careless whisper" is a original by Seether not knowing George Michael. Though I think Seether did a great remake of it.

Seether - Careless Whisper Official Music Video with lyrics - YouTube
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Old 05-07-2013, 07:00 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 36,978,939 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Not a intentional racial thing though, just ignorance because most of us are tuned in to a limited scope, some people being just tuned in to their local station and like a song they hear but never give it any thought beyond.
I agree, it wasn't/isn't intentional on the individual level but it certainly was intentional on a institutional level because for decades this nation could never give credit or accept that something created by the Negro race could be of any value. And, as was the case with minstrel music, in order to be popularly accepted it had to be portrayed in the most racist manner. The fact that you, me or anyone else didn't recognize that one song or another was a cover of some earlier artist isn't the point because as you that ignorance cuts across race and genres, but the fact that the "British Invasion" was treated institutionally as some new wave of music without any real effort to point out that this was first and foremost an original AMERICAN art form and that art for was created by African Americans is the issue.

By the way, as weird as this may seem, a recent symposium held in Chicago was organized around the proposition that African Americans blues artist are being marginalized by the record industry and festival and concert promoters.

Sparks fly in conference on 'Race, Gender & the Blues' - Chicago Tribune
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Old 05-08-2013, 09:57 AM
Status: "117 N/A" (set 3 days ago)
 
12,920 posts, read 13,613,626 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post

By the way, as weird as this may seem, a recent symposium held in Chicago was organized around the proposition that African Americans blues artist are being marginalized by the record industry and festival and concert promoters.

Sparks fly in conference on 'Race, Gender & the Blues' - Chicago Tribune
This is precisely why many black people don't go to blues festivals. They don't recognized the music as being their own anymore. At this point in the game there is enough blame to go around. I am a bit frustrated when blacks in the business rise to level of J Z and they feel no responsibility to promote music other than music that makes them rich. Classical ,Jazz and folk music are recorded and marketed at some what of a loss to the big companies. But for generations large labels have promoted this music for the music itself. Why aren't black entrepreneurs in the music business doing this ?

We cant turn back the hands of time. 100 years of Segregation gives black artist a different perspective. Black ; classical , folk and jazz musicians have to suppress their identity and unique perspectives to make a living.
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Old 05-08-2013, 10:04 AM
 
Location: Charlotte
602 posts, read 572,722 times
Reputation: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
And that is the gist of the problem because for the majority of Americans when the blues came back from England on the rebound, white Americans didn't know where it had come from in the first place. How many white kids knew that the "Time is On My Side" didn't spring from the mind of Mick Jagger but was originally sung by Irma Thomas, that "Piece of My Heart" wasn't a creation of Janis Joplin but Erma Franklin, that the Allman Brothers "Statesboro blues goes back to 1928 and Willie McTell's, or that the Hot Chilli Peppers' “They’re Red Hot” was actually Robert Johnson's, or that the Door's Back Door Man was Howlin' Wolf not to be confused with Wolf Man Jack?

Yes, everybody knows about Hendrix and that Hendrix was a black guy, but how many really understand the impact of American blues on Rock and Roll and the contribution of a whole lot more than a handful of African Americans created that music.

Unfortunately blues-based rock isn't mainstream anymore (I really, really wish that wasn't the case). Some bands have been getting traction (Black Keys, Jack White, etc) but for the most part any "rock" you hear coming out these days is pop/EMO/electric/crap.
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Old 05-08-2013, 10:12 AM
 
9,240 posts, read 8,651,972 times
Reputation: 2225
Its more of generational thing. Currently its Hip Hop.

Country music is heavily influenced by Black Gospel and Blues. Black people invented blues which evolved from Gospel and it took off and evolved into rock and roll.

Interesting article below:

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