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Originally Posted by Cruzincat View Post
Where are the facts that show GZ did not start returning to his vehicle when the dispatcher said "We don't need you to do that."? Crickets?
Crickets? I think not.
7:11:40 "he's running" (GZ gets out of his truck)
wind sounds from running
7:12:00 "are you following him?" "we don't need you to do that" (GZ claims this was at the "T".)
more wind sounds from running until 7:12:18
At this point GZ appears to be at the far end of the path
7:13:10 "I don't want to give out my address out loud, I don't where this kid is" (GZ assumes TM is hiding in the shadows nearby)
7:13:15 "do you want to meet with police at the mailboxes?"
7:13:20 "can you have them call me and I'll tell them where I'm at?" (GZ admits he has no intention of returning to his truck, but is continuing his hunt)
7:13:40 end of phone call
7:16:11 first 911 call
7:17 police arrive
This is what happens when I give the benefit of doubt to folks. You want factual evidence about Zimmerman returning to his truck!
Dispatcher: Okay do you want to just meet them right near the mailboxes then?
Zimmerman: Yeah that's fine.
Dispatcher: Alright George, I'll let them know to meet you around there okay?
Zimmerman: Actually could you have them call me and I'll tell them where I'm at?
So Zimmerman had no intention of meeting the police at the pre-arranged meeting place that he had agreed to. He was going to be somewhere else. Where else?? Certainly not by the mail boxes that the police had asked him to go to.
7:13:41 Zimmerman call to police ends.
7:16:00 2 minutes and 20 seconds later Martin's phone goes dead.
7:16:11 first 911 call reporting a fight.
7:16:55 first 911 call of reporting gun shots.
7:17:00 first officers arrive.
So we are suppose to believe that it takes Zimmerman 2 minutes and 20 second to return to his truck parked on a matter of a few feet away. That he is confronted and attacked by Martin over two minutes later, engages in a life and death struggle that only shooting Martin could stop, all in the matter of 55 seconds (that's without accounting for the time for the callers to react and connect with the 911 operators).
Those are facts, not conjecture, not supposition but rather facts that are not open for debate.
Originally Posted by Cruzincat View Post
Then the 911 tape will show that TM was acting suspicious. Who will refute that?
It's not a 911 tape. GZ called a non-emergency number. The tape does not show that TM was acting suspicious, but just that GZ claims that TM was acting suspicious. The tape's timeline shows that TM came through the short-cut (west side of the community) and walked east through the development toward his home with GZ following him, pulling ahead, parking, then following TM again to the cut-off where GZ got out of his truck. GZ has made no claim that TM went off the public road to peer into windows. The front of these homes have garages and a front door - no ground floor windows to peer into from the street. The tape's timeline shows no suspicious activity on TM's part... just TM being leery of this guy stalking him.
That's not a bingo. It means there are no witnesses, one way or the other, except for GZ to comment on TM's demeanor. It's the liar Zimmerman's word we have to take. "Trust me".
As has been posted previously, he had a duty to try to do everything else possible before shooting Trayvon, by law!
I really don't feel like writing a book to describe how many things there are that are wrong with the above statement, but I'll just summarize all that by saying that you don't have any grasp of the laws surrounding the use of deadly force in the context of self defense, and this case in particular.
This is what happens when I give the benefit of doubt to folks. You want factual evidence about Zimmerman returning to his truck!
Dispatcher: Okay do you want to just meet them right near the mailboxes then?
Zimmerman: Yeah that's fine.
Dispatcher: Alright George, I'll let them know to meet you around there okay?
Zimmerman: Actually could you have them call me and I'll tell them where I'm at?
So Zimmerman had no intention of meeting the police at the pre-arranged meeting place that he had agreed to. He was going to be somewhere else. Where else?? Certainly not by the mail boxes that the police had asked him to go to.
7:13:41 Zimmerman call to police ends.
7:16:00 2 minutes and 20 seconds later Martin's phone goes dead.
7:16:11 first 911 call reporting a fight.
7:16:55 first 911 call of reporting gun shots.
7:17:00 first officers arrive.
So we are suppose to believe that it takes Zimmerman 2 minutes and 20 second to return to his truck parked on a matter of a few feet away. That he is confronted and attacked by Martin over two minutes later, engages in a life and death struggle that only shooting Martin could stop, all in the matter of 55 seconds (that's without accounting for the time for the callers to react and connect with the 911 operators).
Those are facts, not conjecture, not supposition but rather facts that are not open for debate.
The timeline indicates that GZ must have gone back to the T, turned (detour!), and gone down the path and confronted TM close to where his body was found. GZ however says he did not turn, and was attacked at the T - about 40 feet from where TM wound up dead.
I really don't feel like writing a book to describe how many things there are that are wrong with the above statement, but I'll just summarize all that by saying that you don't have any grasp of the laws surrounding the use of deadly force in the context of self defense, and this case in particular.
Some states still have "The duty to retreat", mostly the northeast.
But not Florida and others like TX that have adopted different laws.
Some states still have "The duty to retreat", mostly the northeast.
But not Florida and others like TX that have adopted different laws.
The duty to retreat and the concept of stand your ground are both moot when you are the person that initiated contact and are responsible for the confrontation.
How could Zimmerman have been standing his ground while he was chasing Martin around the neighborhood?
Is a rapist standing their ground and authorized to use deadly force if the rape victim decides to fight back against their attack?
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