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Old 11-14-2007, 07:52 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 18,972,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artliquide View Post
I agree. I think Bush is much more of a kid than a leader. Sometimes I imagine him playing with a bunch of GI Joes in the Oval Office. I'm sure someone has already drawn that editorial cartoon though.

As much as I dislike him, I've read about how environmentally friendly his house in TX is. Even the worst leaders can do good things sometimes.
His ranch is environmentally friendly because Christie Whitman had recommended her contractor and he went with the guy. He did not know, at the time, that the guy was a green builder, and Ms. Whitman did not see a reason to tell him.

 
Old 11-14-2007, 07:53 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 18,972,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay F View Post
I would vote for him for a third time if i could. I might be in the minority that approves of Bush, but it's a larger minority than those who approve of our Dem controlled congress.
Family, no doubt.
 
Old 11-14-2007, 08:10 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 18,972,661 times
Reputation: 8912
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nirvana-Guy View Post
In 2004, the people had no choice. John Kerry is a moron, a complete idiot, 100x worse than Bush.

I wish Gore had won in 2000, because he'd have apologized to the terrorists for 9/11, sent them a ton of cash to "appease them", and that would have been it. Then in 2004, we could have chosen a much better president and Congress would still be in GOP hands.

At least Gore is anti-illegals and Gore would have sucked so bad, the GOP would easily cruise to another victory in 2008.

The sad part is Bush deceived people that he was a Conservative, while in reality he is a Neo-Liberal (as Lou Dobbs calls him). He is a mix of a liberal and a Neo-Con. Bush really tricked us there.... Bush did NOT trick us into going into Iraq. Saddam managed to trick everyone that he had WMDs because he was afraid of Iran, he even tricked his own Iraqui generals that he had developed WMDs. What Bush did was trick us into believing he was a conservative, because he is a John McCain-style LIBERAL.
How can you slur McCain with such talk? I am not a Republican, but I see McCain as one of the true patriots who is running. Bush is just a Corporatist lacky, and when the chips are down he will always back financial interests before the American people. He has no values other than a lust for power, connections, influence, money - and he is just, plain, dumb.

Unlike the current crowd in the White House, McCain actually joined the military to fight for this country(as did Kerry). Truly, public opinion to the contrary, such people do not enter into war lightly, because they have seen, first hand, the horrors it does to social bonds, the often pulling of the human spirit down beneath those of animals.

Many people knew Bush for what he was when he was only governor. If more people started thinking with the brains that God gave them, perhaps they would not be swayed so easily by both religious and political spin. Because a person goes through the steps and says the words, it does not make him a moral man, even though the words he says are attractive. Sometimes the guy who says it like it is, the honest one, is passed over because he will not compromise his honor for the sake of a buck.

Last edited by goldengrain; 11-14-2007 at 08:28 AM..
 
Old 11-14-2007, 08:26 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 18,972,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alexander59 View Post
Of all the presidents I have been alive for this president is the one I would not be honored to meet. I did not vote for him either time and the people I know that voted for him are now denying it, including some die hard used to be Rush fans.
I honestly believe we are going to need a great president this time and unfortunately I see no candidate. Yes I have sympathy for most of those that voted him, they certainly did not know all the havoc that was to come. MY sympathy is mostly for our beautiful country that will take years to recoup our reputation and prestige in the world.
Not to mention our economy.
This country has so many problems.

There are estimates that 50% of the crime is due to drugs, or drug related.
Many/most of South American countries' economies are heavily dependent on drug sales to the US.

I wonder if the governments of countries where drugs are legal, and not so profitable, are as corrupt?

I remember, during the Sandanista affair how the CIA, under either the Directorship or Presidency of Bush H, was caught importing drugs into the US for sale here to finance their black operations.
Do any of us think that a government that corrupt has 'seen the light'? Do we think that Bush W's cocaine years were divorced from this?
Does anyone think that a politicial family, now so wealthy, might not have made that wealth from such illegal means? It would not be the first time.

I, personally, think that the middle class in this country is being systematically done away with. In much of South America there are the small wealthy rulers and the poor peasants, pretty much too busy to involve themselves in anything but scraping away for sustanence.

With all the downsizing and importing of illegals this generation of Americans, for the first time, are doing more poorly than their parents.

All the debt that Bush's war has given us will affect the well-being of future generations. This, from a man who was handed a debt free government from Bill Clinton. What a present!
 
Old 11-14-2007, 08:46 AM
 
2,079 posts, read 4,951,905 times
Reputation: 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
All the debt that Bush's war has given us will affect the well-being of future generations. This, from a man who was handed a debt free government from Bill Clinton. What a present!
Honestly, I just cannot see why Bush does not do what is really in the best interest of the United States and simply resign from office. The man is aware of the damage he is doing to this country each day he continues to serve in office as well as the long term damages he has done worldwide over the course of the last 6 years or so, yet because of his stubborness he refuses to acknowledge his incompetence and leave office.

Last edited by dorado0359; 11-14-2007 at 09:25 AM.. Reason: error
 
Old 11-14-2007, 09:03 AM
 
Location: Gilbert, AZ
788 posts, read 2,110,687 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
How can you slur McCain with such talk? I am not a Republican, but I see McCain as one of the true patriots who is running. Bush is just a Corporatist lacky, and when the chips are down he will always back financial interests before the American people. He has no values other than a lust for power, connections, influence, money - and he is just, plain, dumb.

Unlike the current crowd in the White House, McCain actually joined the military to fight for this country(as did Kerry). Truly, public opinion to the contrary, such people do not enter into war lightly, because they have seen, first hand, the horrors it does to social bonds, the often pulling of the human spirit down beneath those of animals.

Many people knew Bush for what he was when he was only governor. If more people started thinking with the brains that God gave them, perhaps they would not be swayed so easily by both religious and political spin. Because a person goes through the steps and says the words, it does not make him a moral man, even though the words he says are attractive. Sometimes the guy who says it like it is, the honest one, is passed over because he will not compromise his honor for the sake of a buck.
You know, I've really liked McCain over the years, and have voted to reelect him as one of my state senators in the last few elections. As I've stated before, I'm independent, and the reason for that is that I know I will never agree with anyone completely on all issues, but I want to be able to choose my representatives according to their merits, regardless of party affiliation. My district's representative in the House is Jeff Flake. He is a mormon, but I probably shouldn't have even mentioned that because I don't think it matters. I really like him for some of the same reasons I like McCain. They both seem level headed, and interested in reducing corruption in Congress. One of Flake's main goals in Congress is to eliminate earmarking and pork laden bills, which I'm highly against. Neither Flake nor McCain's religions concern me, even though I'm not religious, because I don't feel like they use religion to manipulate people or use religion as their agenda (as I get the impression Bush and many others do).

I may not agree with them both on morality and social issues (I tend to be more liberal in those areas), but I respect them both for being straight shooters in Congress. McCain has lapsed a bit during this war crisis that Bush caused, but I still respect him for the most part. I was actually very disappointed that he didn't beat Bush in the primaries. If Bush had the general integrity that these two have, I may have voted for him. I knew he was spinning the truth from the beginning though.
 
Old 11-17-2007, 08:40 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 18,972,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yeledaf View Post
What is this supposed to prove? That the US supported those who opposed the Russian invasion of Afghanistan, which led directly to the collapse of the USSR? Would you prefer the return of the Soviet Union and the re-enslavement of Eastern Europe? .
THe interesting thing is that this country was better, in many ways, in those days.

There was such fear of Communisim taking over in this country that labor was strong and companies were not downsizing and importing cheap help. Generally, if you had a job, you had health care.

It seems that, almost immediately with the Soviet downfall, came industries' big chance to make even greater profits by screwing citizens.

Of course, you will probably find some twisted way of applauding this change - some way of saying that the sick and jobless are getting their due.

Last edited by goldengrain; 11-17-2007 at 09:00 AM..
 
Old 11-17-2007, 08:58 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 18,972,661 times
Reputation: 8912
Quote:
Originally Posted by dorado0359 View Post
Honestly, I just cannot see why Bush does not do what is really in the best interest of the United States and simply resign from office. The man is aware of the damage he is doing to this country each day he continues to serve in office as well as the long term damages he has done worldwide over the course of the last 6 years or so, yet because of his stubborness he refuses to acknowledge his incompetence and leave office.
May I suggest that you could be making a big mistake by assuming that he cares? I think he is a type of sociopath. I think he cannot feel empathy for others, and the further away from wealth and power a person is, the less compassion he is due, in the 'bible according to Bush'.

He is not a philosophic thinker. He cares not to have a good place in history. He cares not for the freedoms this country stands for, for the citizens, for the people who have fought and died for the ideals of this country.

All that matters is furthering power, influence, and money. Dealing his friends a good hand so they will reciprocate when he comes knocking. They say he is loyal. Well, this is the sort of person he is loyal to. There is no conscience. Just gain or loss.

Life, for him, is one big financial statement with entries in the plus or minus side. There is no room for nuance or subtlety, shadings of grey, extenuating circumstances. You've probably worked with someone like this - who stopped at nothing to get ahead, pulled strings, brown nosed, sacrificed his underlings.

How do we prevent another mental case from assuming the position? How do we curtail the powers of the Presidency (end the War Powers Act) and perhaps have a President up for review every year or so where he has to defend his actions and show reason why he should not be impeached.

I mean that. It should be a priviledge for a person to be President and he/she should have to earn it while they are in office. The default should be to get rid of them. They should have to appear before the people and plead with us to be allowed to stay in office.

The kids are very, very, lucky that Laura has stayed there to rear them.
 
Old 11-17-2007, 09:20 AM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,476,088 times
Reputation: 4013
There is no reason to have sympathy for those who voted for Bush, nor for those who have so fervently but baselessly supported his programs and actions since. The cards were laid on the table from the very beginning. They were ignored. And as forecast, the right has been proved drop-dead wrong about everything from top to bottom, from soup to nuts, and from A to Z. The nation will be decades in apologizing for this debacle and in cleaning up the mess that has resulted from it. And the very last to apologize will be those who caused it. Sympathy for the country, yes. For the Bushies, no...
 
Old 11-17-2007, 10:02 AM
 
Location: Near Manito
20,169 posts, read 24,330,946 times
Reputation: 15291
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
There is no reason to have sympathy for those who voted for Bush, nor for those who have so fervently but baselessly supported his programs and actions since. The cards were laid on the table from the very beginning. They were ignored. And as forecast, the right has been proved drop-dead wrong about everything from top to bottom, from soup to nuts, and from A to Z. The nation will be decades in apologizing for this debacle and in cleaning up the mess that has resulted from it. And the very last to apologize will be those who caused it. Sympathy for the country, yes. For the Bushies, no...
And to think it all started when Jimmy Carter kowtowed to the mullahs, and opened the doors to their temerity and provided a model for our timidity.

Mr. Peanut and his defenders ought to apologize for being alive.
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