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Old 08-23-2013, 07:55 AM
 
Location: On the Group W bench
5,563 posts, read 4,253,497 times
Reputation: 2127

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Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
I am 27 years old. Stop using personal experiences as your 'rules' for how everything will act. Your daughter's TV habits or your parent's college experience is an extremely poor way to set a rule for everyone. National statistics disagree with you. Are there exceptions? Obviously, but you do know what national averages mean, don't you?

College isn't about the 'life experience'. It is about preparing a student for the real world. Students need to have less 'life experience' (which is a code word for relaxing and having fun) and spend more time and effort studying and working. Employers want candidates who are prepared for the job. When I am hiring someone, I want someone who has knowledge and skills that they can use at my workplace. I couldn't care less what 'life experience' they got.

The more we have had students focus on the 'life experience' of college and less on the studying and education, the farther this nation has slipped in education rankings globally, and the more students do not graduate. You call that a good thing?
I'm not using personal experience as my "rules." As I said, I'm just pointing out that these broad-based assumptions are just that, assumptions.

I don't know where you went to college, but as a parent of three kids, one of whom has graduated and two of whom are in college now, "life experience" doesn't mean "partying." And that life experience I specifically mentioned, that employers want, involves working, interning and volunteering.

Why you're on a rant to condemn all students and ignoring the actual things I posted, I don't know. Perhaps you haven't had your coffee yet.
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:56 AM
 
Location: On the Group W bench
5,563 posts, read 4,253,497 times
Reputation: 2127
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
Yes and that's why Indians and Chinese are getting all the high paying STEM jobs while Americans settle for Starbucks counter jobs.

To the rest of the world college IS about studying and getting good grades.
Proof? Citations? Statistics?

The students I know ARE studying and getting good grades. They are also working, volunteering and interning to be prepared for the work environment.

Perhaps the students I know are the only ones like that in the entire US. You'd certainly think so based on the cons whining on this forum. But I doubt it.
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Old 08-23-2013, 08:08 AM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
20,110 posts, read 16,089,167 times
Reputation: 28292
We currently have what is considered the best higher education system in the world and now the federal government wants to do to it what they did to public K-12 education? Great. Just f*^~ing great.
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Old 08-23-2013, 08:11 AM
 
17,390 posts, read 11,938,010 times
Reputation: 16137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
Who will teach for free and what value would it have of not paid for?
Oh, silly conservative. It won't be FREE. It'll just be paid for with someone else's money. Because the middle class can afford to foot the bill for their neighbor's kid to get a degree in underwater basketweaving. Or better, get a free education that allows junior a lifetime of income that their benefactor is being denied.
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Old 08-23-2013, 08:13 AM
 
17,390 posts, read 11,938,010 times
Reputation: 16137
Quote:
Originally Posted by florida.bob View Post
Whoever benefits from and educated workforce should foot the bill. That would be State and Federal taxpayers as well as businesses.
That would be the student. Because, unless 100% of their future income goes back into pot, they are the true winner in this.
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Old 08-23-2013, 08:19 AM
 
9,855 posts, read 15,181,310 times
Reputation: 5481
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmqueen View Post
I'm not using personal experience as my "rules." As I said, I'm just pointing out that these broad-based assumptions are just that, assumptions.

I don't know where you went to college, but as a parent of three kids, one of whom has graduated and two of whom are in college now, "life experience" doesn't mean "partying." And that life experience I specifically mentioned, that employers want, involves working, interning and volunteering.

Why you're on a rant to condemn all students and ignoring the actual things I posted, I don't know. Perhaps you haven't had your coffee yet.
You are absolutely using personal experience. I quoted national averages and you responded with stories about your daughter and parents.

You haven't posted any facts. You gave me a story about what worked for your family. You still ignore the fact that students study far less now than ever before. I am not condemning students, I am simply stating the fact that students today study less than they did 50 years ago, and that our national educational ranking is lower now relative to the rest of the world now than 50 years ago. How do you think that those are indicators of a good system?
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Old 08-23-2013, 08:55 AM
 
Location: On the Group W bench
5,563 posts, read 4,253,497 times
Reputation: 2127
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
You are absolutely using personal experience. I quoted national averages and you responded with stories about your daughter and parents.

You haven't posted any facts. You gave me a story about what worked for your family. You still ignore the fact that students study far less now than ever before. I am not condemning students, I am simply stating the fact that students today study less than they did 50 years ago, and that our national educational ranking is lower now relative to the rest of the world now than 50 years ago. How do you think that those are indicators of a good system?
I don't know how many times I have to say this. I'm simply reporting what I know to be true, that is, that not all students are out partying all day and night as some posters insist as a blanket assumption.

I am also saying that from what I understand about what colleges and employers want -- and that is from reading widely, material which is available to everyone so it should be common knowledge -- is experience from work, including paid work, volunteering and interning. Of COURSE students are studying less. Those things take time out of their day and means they're not acing every test like students do who have NOTHING else to do but study. Like in Asia.

Sheesh.

You can keep ranting at me, but you're not reading my posts, so I don't think this conversation is going anywhere.
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:01 AM
 
3,537 posts, read 2,730,466 times
Reputation: 1034
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ringo1 View Post
Pages and pages of conservatives encouraging trade school over college. I'm not shocked
Do not know what pages you were reading; Conservatives were not the only ones saying that and no one said trade school over college. It is a viable alternative for some who may not find college appealing.

Get off your high horse and realize not everyone is made for 4-8 years of learning in a classroom. DO we not need people in the trades? Do you look down upon your mechanic or Air conditioner repair person?
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:07 AM
 
3,537 posts, read 2,730,466 times
Reputation: 1034
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
Yes and that's why Indians and Chinese are getting all the high paying STEM jobs while Americans settle for Starbucks counter jobs.

To the rest of the world college IS about studying and getting good grades.
Oh come on- we know thats what college is for!

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Old 08-23-2013, 12:14 PM
 
9,855 posts, read 15,181,310 times
Reputation: 5481
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmqueen View Post
I don't know how many times I have to say this. I'm simply reporting what I know to be true, that is, that not all students are out partying all day and night as some posters insist as a blanket assumption.

I am also saying that from what I understand about what colleges and employers want -- and that is from reading widely, material which is available to everyone so it should be common knowledge -- is experience from work, including paid work, volunteering and interning. Of COURSE students are studying less. Those things take time out of their day and means they're not acing every test like students do who have NOTHING else to do but study. Like in Asia.

Sheesh.

You can keep ranting at me, but you're not reading my posts, so I don't think this conversation is going anywhere.
You are showing that you don't know what an average is. My saying the average number of hours a student studies is 15/week is also saying there are students who study more and less than that. That is the definition of an average. It isn't a blanked assumption, it is understanding what the word average means.

I am reading your posts. You claim that you know things to be true without posting a single fact. Obviously students need to volunteer, intern, etc., but they also need to study more. You keep ignoring the fact that the united states is falling behind the rest of the world more and move as time goes on. Something about the current system is broken. What students in Asia do nothing but study? They do as much outside of the classroom as american students do, they just study more when american students are hanging out and relaxing.
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