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I still don't understand how conceal and carry prevents a crime. If the gun is concealed, what is it exactly that prevents a crime? Just because you stop the crime from being successful doesn't mean it didn't happen.
The problem with society isn't the lack of guns, it's the fact that so many people do not feel they are part of the community of decent people who live by the law and look out for others. That is our problem but people just don't want to deal with that.
I still don't understand how conceal and carry prevents a crime. If the gun is concealed, what is it exactly that prevents a crime? Just because you stop the crime from being successful doesn't mean it didn't happen.
If the potential crime was rape or murder then yes, stopping the crime from being successful means that it didn't happen. If a rapist grabs a woman with the intention of sexually assaulting her and she shoots and kills him with her concealed handgun she prevented a rape.
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The problem with society isn't the lack of guns, it's the fact that so many people do not feel they are part of the community of decent people who live by the law and look out for others. That is our problem but people just don't want to deal with that.
I know, it has already been mentioned that in the US protecting society is not the job of the police anymore. I find that a bit regrettable...
Unless you are paying someone to guard you 24x7x365 then the police aren't protecting you specifically either. In Portugal, can you sue the police for failing to do their job when you are assaulted or robbed? If the answer is "no you can't sue the police" then they aren't protecting you either.
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Originally Posted by Neuling
It doesn't really matter what you kill the pythons with The point is that your constitution and laws allow, almost promote the spread of guns. And as a consequence you have all those armed criminals out there that people feel they need to protect themselves from. I just don't want such an arms race.
The good guys win the arms race 99% of the time or more.
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Originally Posted by Neuling
I expect not to be robbed, attacked etc., whether I am at home or outside. That expectation, based on my trust in our more or less competent police force and also in a more or less peaceful society, prevents me from feeling like I need to protect myself. And the vast majority of people I know feel that way as well.
Trusting your safety to the police is like trusting the government since the police are part of your local .gov. You will probably find a high correlation between government distrust and gun ownership in the U.S.
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Originally Posted by Neuling
It is a totally different approach compared to the US.
The U.S. is a very large place and a lot of people are like you.
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Originally Posted by Neuling
Of course there is also some crime here, occasionally there are murders etc. But we do not take them for granted, they are considered shocking exceptions so to speak. Thus we continue to trust it won't happen to us. And usually that is the way it is.
This woman thought it wouldn't happen to her either and she was wrong - Home Invasion in Millburn NJ caught on nanny cam - brutal beating in front of daughter June, 2013 - YouTube This is one of thousands of examples of people being unprepared. If you watch the video, they are talking to the victim while the alarm company is installing an alarm. That alarm should have already been installed and doors should have been locked at minimum.
They don't have to protect me specifically, but society as a whole, which is their job. This creates an atmosphere where I can feel safe.
The outcome (you claim) has nothing to do with the fact that I don't want an arms race in civilian society.
While I do not trust certain areas of government such as military, secret services or the government as such, I pretty much do trust in the police, who have a good reputation, although they are not perfect, either, of course. But their reputation here is far better than in the US.
Of course crimes happen, the difference is that they simply do not lead people here to think they need to get armed in order to prevent them. I believe you can't really understand that since you probably didn't grow up or spend most of your life here. Just like I can't understand Americans with respect to guns. It's a totally different mindset...
Love? Well, that would be nice, but I am not that optimistic Probably guns will simply lose their importance as people feel less threatened, and that in turn will happen because of a changing society/economy.
Nope, I will still hunt wild game as deer and birds, plus shoot garden varmints like deer and birds. In the morning Wed I leave for a primitive event based on history and shooting.
For some people this is interesting, and enough so the participants pay and return for years. This will be my 32nd time at this event. Schools will bring children (Oh My God! ) Tourists will attend by purpose and by just happening on to the event which can be seen from Rt 16, a main road in NH USA thru the mts here.
Every single camp will have at least one gun if not 3... Rifle, smooth bore and pistol, all flintlocks, and in my camp there will be at least a modern for self defense pistol because I am not Stupid. But no one will get to see that gun unless i intend to shoot them, so if the do it will be brief.
I expect cannon too, but am not bringing mine this time, since I haven't finished some changes i have been making.
A key problem with the Euro way is Euro has been hunted out, it's history has been lost. The euro people never had Rights, and were always 'Subjects' to some Royal's we never had, nor do we want, and Obama is just finding this out.
Another problem is the size of western Euro. England is the size of Washington State. We could place several Euro countries inside Texas with room to spare.
I have ridden a motor cycle from NH to Cal and back riding in 40 states. In all of these states i saw deer. I suspect there are deer to hunt in all 48 lower states. In fat i would bet cash money that deer live and are hunted in the 8 states I missed and in Alaska too, but i don't know if deer live in Hi or not and i don't care.
And then I know Americans who hunt deer Elk and Caribou Canada too legally with guns.
Guns, Hunting, man defending himself from predator man is not going to end for so lang as man lives......
The whole idea is just silly. And then we all have the govt problem where the govts are all ARMED.....
To me it works like this..... First ALL Govts must disarm... All of them.........
Then all police and every other govt faction, then all criminals LOL As if
Then all the rest of the hunters, and I will go last.
My fathers defended western Euro and the world in WW-2 or you would be living in Hitlers 3rd Reich, and so might I in NH USA too.
My son was in the sand box, and his some who is 4 already has a gun, but he just doesn't know it.
That's 5 generations of Hunters, who are not going away, and will out live every gun grabber now alive.
My guns run from flintlocks to AK-47........ I keep the papers rolled up in the barrel. and so it depends on just how fast some govt agent wants to see them i guess.....
Never going to happen..... Just say NO! 0 Tolerance for gun grabber's.
We don't care what gun grabbers think, because we are not sure gun grabbers think at all.
This administration is more concerned with an uprising of the people,
not their security.
Hence the attack on semiautomatic rifles, not hand guns.
Rifles are only rarely used in crimes, but are mostly used in battle.
That is the issue plain and simple.
This government is working to be compliant to the NATO agenda21
Read it for your self folks.
Nope, I will still hunt wild game as deer and birds, plus shoot garden varmints like deer and birds. In the morning Wed I leave for a primitive event based on history and shooting.
For some people this is interesting, and enough so the participants pay and return for years. This will be my 32nd time at this event. Schools will bring children (Oh My God! ) Tourists will attend by purpose and by just happening on to the event which can be seen from Rt 16, a main road in NH USA thru the mts here.
Every single camp will have at least one gun if not 3... Rifle, smooth bore and pistol, all flintlocks, and in my camp there will be at least a modern for self defense pistol because I am not Stupid. But no one will get to see that gun unless i intend to shoot them, so if the do it will be brief.
I expect cannon too, but am not bringing mine this time, since I haven't finished some changes i have been making.
A key problem with the Euro way is Euro has been hunted out, it's history has been lost. The euro people never had Rights, and were always 'Subjects' to some Royal's we never had, nor do we want, and Obama is just finding this out.
Another problem is the size of western Euro. England is the size of Washington State. We could place several Euro countries inside Texas with room to spare.
I have ridden a motor cycle from NH to Cal and back riding in 40 states. In all of these states i saw deer. I suspect there are deer to hunt in all 48 lower states. In fat i would bet cash money that deer live and are hunted in the 8 states I missed and in Alaska too, but i don't know if deer live in Hi or not and i don't care.
And then I know Americans who hunt deer Elk and Caribou Canada too legally with guns.
Guns, Hunting, man defending himself from predator man is not going to end for so lang as man lives......
The whole idea is just silly. And then we all have the govt problem where the govts are all ARMED.....
To me it works like this..... First ALL Govts must disarm... All of them.........
Then all police and every other govt faction, then all criminals LOL As if
Then all the rest of the hunters, and I will go last.
My fathers defended western Euro and the world in WW-2 or you would be living in Hitlers 3rd Reich, and so might I in NH USA too.
My son was in the sand box, and his some who is 4 already has a gun, but he just doesn't know it.
That's 5 generations of Hunters, who are not going away, and will out live every gun grabber now alive.
My guns run from flintlocks to AK-47........ I keep the papers rolled up in the barrel. and so it depends on just how fast some govt agent wants to see them i guess.....
Never going to happen..... Just say NO! 0 Tolerance for gun grabber's.
We don't care what gun grabbers think, because we are not sure gun grabbers think at all.
Well, do what you want, but to me you are just an outdated fool and I am happy I don't have anything to do with people like you
Just a thought: maybe if our government used more diplomacy and less military in its relations with other countries, then the citizens would consider other ways to live. After all, monkey see, monkey do. Like father, like son.
Otherwise, you could just have a more humane response to those who commit crimes with guns: amputation of an arm or two.
That way, they have the opportunity to rehabilitate and reintegrate in society, without the need for death penalties, prisons and high recidivism.
In this scenario, I think anyone would think twice about using guns.
Of course, the best scenario would be that society came together more, to help each other rather than live like everyone is competing against his neighbor for more money, more goods, more....
Peace.
brian
Yeah too bad FDR did anything back in WW-2...... i still wish the USA had stayed out of that to this day...
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The point is that your constitution and laws allow, almost promote the spread of guns. And as a consequence you have all those armed criminals out there that people feel they need to protect themselves from. I just don't want such an arms race. 
Probably guns will simply lose their importance as people feel less threatened, and that in turn will happen because of a changing society/economy.
) Tourists will attend by purpose and by just happening on to the event which can be seen from Rt 16, a main road in NH USA thru the mts here.
