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Old 09-03-2013, 09:58 AM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,738,058 times
Reputation: 20674

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Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
We obviously have some problems with our system since some people are uninsured and the upcoming Obamacare train wreck will only make things worse (as planned), but I would still rather get sick in America than anywhere else in the world.

Cancer Survival Rates Vary by Country
To do ^ justice, one needs to break it down by age at diagnosis.
Where the U.S. does better is when the patient is at least 65 and on Medicare.
< 65, not so much because too many cannot afford routine tests and medical care. They are more likely to present in an ER with stage 4 cancer.

Not all Cancers are equal. Some nations do a better job with some forms of Cancer.
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:05 AM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,738,058 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patton360 View Post
Yet, when the government makes those decisions, it's okay?
Does government make healthcare choices for Medicare patients?
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:08 AM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,738,058 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by weltschmerz View Post
Profit? Our healthcare isn't for-profit. That's your problem, right there.
Most U.S. hospitals are NFP which does not mean they are required to deliver care at cost. Most U.S. hospitals have substantial annual profits and use those profits to build geographical monopolies and control the market.
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:08 AM
 
9,470 posts, read 6,969,002 times
Reputation: 2177
Quote:
Originally Posted by armourereric View Post
I have around 40 Canadian clients a year, about 80% abhor their health system, especially those form Vancouver. I listen to Rush, but never really noted conservative bashing of the heath system in Canada, my clients from there do a good enough job.

The biggest story I get is that Vancouver hospitals send women in labor to Seattle by ambulance to give birth, because it is cheaper to reimburse everyone involved than do it local. This has been confirmed by my customers as true.
I'm not sure it's "cheaper", but the system has budget and rule and asset allocation inflexibility, and it may be, for internal purposes, easier to get budget allocations to offload people across the border, than it is to structurally change staffing to accommodate the peaks in demand.
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:11 AM
 
Location: 77441
3,160 posts, read 4,366,895 times
Reputation: 2314
Quote:
Originally Posted by theunbrainwashed View Post

When none of them have had any experience with such a system? BLAH BLAH BLAH

you're post isnt worth answering.
the simple statements below is enough evidence.

you say ALL Republicans"
and "NONE of them"

obama supports should stick to keeping their head in the sand and not insulting taxpayers.
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:15 AM
 
9,470 posts, read 6,969,002 times
Reputation: 2177
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Most U.S. hospitals are NFP which does not mean they are required to deliver care at cost. Most U.S. hospitals have substantial annual profits and use those profits to build geographical monopolies and control the market.
I think too few understand that distinction.

"Not for profit" merely means that if there is positive cash flow, it does not go to whoever owns the facility as taxable income. Positive cash flow for a not-for-for profit is generally used to buy things, update things, etc - often precisely the same as a for profit institution would. There is a built in incentive to find things to spend money on (needed or not) to make the accounting work out.

It's a status that mostly pertains to the IRS, not operations.

As you say, nothing about "not for profit" means "deliver at cost", it merely means that there aren't owners and investors trying to make money. It could lose money or it could have large amounts of positive cash flow and still retain the N-F-P status.

When people say "we have to get the profit out" of health care, it's easily accomplished by raising expenses, rather than lowering prices - which is how every government agency makes sure it spends its budget.
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:16 AM
 
9,470 posts, read 6,969,002 times
Reputation: 2177
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Does government make healthcare choices for Medicare patients?
It sure does.

My mother died rather young because Medicare refused to authorize what she needed.
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:37 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,469,715 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by pnwmdk View Post
Doubtful.

Just like few starve.

If prices of health care services were based on what people could pay, we could afford most things. For those few catastrophic events, we could have true insurance (wow, what a concept...).
A free market based on what people could pay? Does that mean a poorer person pays less for the same car or car insurance coverage? Or is it the poor just settle on getting a lower grade of car or less coverage and care?

The closest the world comes to a free market in HC is Zimbabwe.
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:39 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,469,715 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by pnwmdk View Post
It sure does.

My mother died rather young because Medicare refused to authorize what she needed.
Can you be more specific?
This is quite unusual for Medicare. One major defect of Medicare is that they cover too much and too easily.
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Old 09-03-2013, 10:43 AM
 
9,470 posts, read 6,969,002 times
Reputation: 2177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
A free market based on what people could pay? Does that mean a poorer person pays less for the same car or car insurance coverage? Or is it the poor just settle on getting a lower grade of car or less coverage and care?

The closest the world comes to a free market in HC is Zimbabwe.
You don't know what a free market is. You need to learn that before you can engage this topic any further.
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