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Old 09-15-2013, 12:22 PM
 
Location: Texas
38,859 posts, read 25,535,277 times
Reputation: 24780

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pnwmdk View Post
Really?

Explain how Fannie and Freddie were "deregulation".

Explain how Fannie and Freddie were "let the market decide"?

The two together pumped 13 TRILLION dollars of lending into the market at less than sustainable market rates.

This is not "deregulation", nor "let the market decide". This is FATAL GOVERNMENT INTERFERENCE.

Blame the GOP for failing to stop it, if you wish.
Take a spoon of your own medicine, bub.

Last edited by CaseyB; 09-15-2013 at 02:15 PM..
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:04 PM
 
8,483 posts, read 6,931,696 times
Reputation: 1119
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
Not individually responsible, as there were many causes; however, Mr. Frank certainly was a major player in the financial collapse, due to his close ties with Fannie and Freddie.

Who WAS responsible?

1. Those who initiated the "fair housing act"
2. Those who banned "red lining"
3. Those who stopped Glass-Steagle
4. Those who who failed to regulate bundled mortgage products
5. Those who promoted, fostered, and benefited from bundled mortgage products

Liberal policy planted the seeds for the collapse. However, many others watered and fertilized this disaster along the way. Oddly, the man blamed for the collapse (Bush) was one of the few who actually tried to stop it, five years prior to the collapse.
Bush contributed his fair share, both of them did. Though the immediate bubble does directly connect to Clinton's admin. However, politics is mostly theater. This is business.

I think you need to go back further. Accounting practices are a key tool here. We allow govt to collect giant pools of money, invest it, buy up everything and keep the profits.

Changing this would make a big difference in how they are allowed to leverage the system. Also need to address the corporate model, since this is what they are using, as well. It is not transparent, for one thing. Repealing Glass-Steagall was part, but the Commodity Modernization Act was a bigger tool imo. This allowed the big derivative market growth. However, there were other actions that also occurred then.

Essentially, we have allowed municipal corps to control, dictate and own transnationals. The corps are all intertwined.
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:10 PM
 
8,483 posts, read 6,931,696 times
Reputation: 1119
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
All roads of this collapse (worldwide I might add) goes back to the banksters and their ability to get laws changed in the various first world countries that privatized profit and socialized risk.

It didn't happen overnight. It happened over time, decades of changing laws along with advanced technology.
People should rethink what they consider private and public entities. They are all corporate and completely intertwined.
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:14 PM
 
9,470 posts, read 6,969,002 times
Reputation: 2177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Gringo View Post
Take a spoon of your own medicine, bub.
You still haven't explained how anything you argue is true.
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:17 PM
 
2,040 posts, read 2,458,964 times
Reputation: 1067
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
LOL The specific regulator was the White House/Treasury, and GOP rejected it, but why repeat what I already told you?
Because it's untrue.

The specific regulator would have been appointed by Congress and would have been independent. And the GOP didn't reject it.....how could they when the entire proposal was nixxed at the committee level by Dodd and Frank? No bote was ever taken in Congress.

Quote:
I didn't like the way Dems did things, and nor did I vote for them, but if GOP has the control of the White House, Senate, Congress and even the Supreme Court, then it's a bit rich they would try to blame someone else for their failings.
Republicans controlled Congress only until 2006. And it's quite easy to stop proposed legislation when the ranking minority members at the committee level veto it before it can come to a vote in the full Congress.

Watch the videos...those are Democrats arguing with the GOP that there is nothing wrong!

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Old 09-15-2013, 01:19 PM
 
Location: The Woodlands, TX
1,718 posts, read 1,055,555 times
Reputation: 1147
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
Not individually responsible, as there were many causes; however, Mr. Frank certainly was a major player in the financial collapse, due to his close ties with Fannie and Freddie.

Who WAS responsible?

1. Those who initiated the "fair housing act"
2. Those who banned "red lining"
3. Those who stopped Glass-Steagle
4. Those who who failed to regulate bundled mortgage products
5. Those who promoted, fostered, and benefited from bundled mortgage products

Liberal policy planted the seeds for the collapse. However, many others watered and fertilized this disaster along the way. Oddly, the man blamed for the collapse (Bush) was one of the few who actually tried to stop it, five years prior to the collapse.
This 100%

On the money
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:23 PM
 
3,493 posts, read 3,203,266 times
Reputation: 6523
It is interesting to note, that at the time he pushed that bill, his BF was this multo-billion dollar banker from Peru who had his hands in a lot of American financial institutions. I bet there was some interesting pillow talk. The possibilities there are endless when you think about it.
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:30 PM
 
8,391 posts, read 6,296,160 times
Reputation: 2314
Quote:
Originally Posted by pnwmdk View Post
Can you explain how offering unqualified people loans at less than sustainable rates, justified by inflated values combined with inadequate equity causes a boom and then disastrous bust cycle following it, and all you can say is "conservative lie" and "hateful conservatives"?

The facts are staring you in the face, but all you can do is spout hate and personal invective.
It is not sustainable, but two things failing loans didn't drive this crisis, and more importantly Barney Frank didn't cause any of those things to happen and neither did Freddie or Fannie and neither did poor people, hispanic people or black people.

So yes while I agree that there was a bubble in real estate, it was created by companies seeking profits, not companies forced by the government. And more importantly those failing loans aren't even what drove the larger crisis which had to do with credit default swops, bundled mortgages being given triple A ratings, etc.

Yet the conservative narrative is oh its those people you know poor people, hispanic people, BLACK people who caused it all because banks were forced to lend to them. Its the homosexual Barney Frank who is too blame. THis is a HATEFUL and a dishonest response.
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:32 PM
 
2,040 posts, read 2,458,964 times
Reputation: 1067
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
LOL The specific regulator was the White House/Treasury, and GOP rejected it, but why repeat what I already told you?

I didn't like the way Dems did things, and nor did I vote for them, but if GOP has the control of the White House, Senate, Congress and even the Supreme Court, then it's a bit rich they would try to blame someone else for their failings.
More proof that is all false....

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/11/bu...annie-mae.html

The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago.

Under the plan, disclosed at a Congressional hearing today, a new agency would be created within the Treasury Department to assume supervision of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the government-sponsored companies that are the two largest players in the mortgage lending industry.

The new agency would have the authority, which now rests with Congress to set one of the two capital-reserve requirements for the companies. It would exercise authority over any new lines of business. And it would determine whether the two are adequately managing the risks of their ballooning portfolios.
........
Mr. Snow said that Congress should eliminate the power of the president to appoint directors to the companies, a sign that the administration is less concerned about the perks of patronage than it is about the potential political problems associated with any new difficulties arising at the companies.


As you can read.....Bush did NOT want the regulator to be part of his WH administration and he actually wanted to give AWAY the right to appoint the directors!



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Old 09-15-2013, 01:33 PM
 
11,086 posts, read 8,543,209 times
Reputation: 6392
You realize that it's worse than ever, right?

Quote:
BIS veteran says global credit excess worse than pre-Lehman

Extreme forms of credit excess across the world have reached or surpassed levels seen shortly before the Lehman crisis five years ago, the Bank for International Settlements has warned.

The Swiss-based `bank of central banks’ said a hunt for yield was luring investors en masse into high-risk instruments, “a phenomenon reminiscent of exuberance prior to the global financial crisis”.

This is happening just as the US Federal Reserve prepares to wind down stimulus and starts to drain dollar liquidity from global markets, an inflexion point that is fraught with danger and could go badly wrong.

“This looks like to me like 2007 all over again, but even worse,” said William White, the BIS’s former chief economist, famous for flagging the wild behaviour in the debt markets before the global storm hit in 2008. ...
BIS veteran says global credit excess worse than pre-Lehman - Telegraph
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