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Old 09-29-2013, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 15,932,320 times
Reputation: 7968

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If you've read any of the P&OC threads about race politics, you will have seen a meme spouted about the "Southern Strategy" and the shift of segregationists from the Democratic to the Republican party during the latter half of the 20th century.

In her excellent Mugged: Racial Demagoguery from the Seventies to Obama Ann Coulter dismantles this revisionism. For practical purposes, she says, the most important segregationists of the era were in the US Senate, "where civil rights bills went to die." She identifies 13 segregationist US Senators:

Harry Byrd Sr. (D, VA)
Robert Byrd (D, W VA)
Allen Ellender (D, LA)
Sam Ervin (D, NC)
Albert Gore Sr. (D, TN)
James Eastland (D, MS)
William Fulbright (D, AR)
Walter George (D, GA)
Ernest Hollings (D,SC)
Russell Long (D, LA)
Richard Russell (D, GA)
John Stennis (D, MS)
Strom Thurmond (D/R, SC)

Of these 13, exactly one switched parties from R to D. Strom Thurmond had been a Democrat until 1948, when he ran for president as a pro-segregation "DixieCrat" in 1948. As the name suggests, this was a splinter group from the Democratic party. Of course that bid failed, and Thurmond went back to being a Democrat, until he decided to switch parties again in 1964.

The others all stayed D for their entire careers. Most of them left the US Senate in the 1970's. A few were around as late as 1989 (John Stennis), 2005 (Ernest Hollings) and 2010 (Robert Byrd). Most were prototypical tax-and-spend Democrats in the mold of Robert Byrd. Sam Ervin in particular was a liberal icon for his role in the Watergate hearings.

There was no massive shift of segregationist Democrats to the Republican party in conjunction with a "Southern Strategy." Another moonbat meme is debunked by Ann Coulter.
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Old 09-29-2013, 12:22 PM
 
Location: Stasis
15,833 posts, read 11,346,580 times
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Post fail. The Southern Strategy was about about moving white southern voters to the Republican party - not moving Democrat Senators.

Southern strategy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 09-29-2013, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 15,932,320 times
Reputation: 7968
Quote:
Originally Posted by katzpaw View Post
Post fail. The Southern Strategy was about about moving white southern voters to the Republican party - not moving Democrat Senators.

Southern strategy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
First, this is a good example of the logical fallacy known as "no true Scotsman." You don't like where my evidence points, so you discount my evidence.
Logical Fallacies» ‘No True Scotsman’ Fallacy

Wouldn't it make sense that segregationist politicians and segregationist voters should have made the same migration together, if there was a migration?

Secondly, your own Wikipedia source shows how overblown talk of the 'Southern Strategy' is. The only real evidence of its existence (in your link) are a couple of quotes from R consultants Lee Atwater and Kevin Phillips (who later became a moonbat liberal).

Lee Atwater was a bare-knuckles politics guy who would do anything to win, but probably not a racist. He was actually a professional musician who recorded with black musicians like Percy Sledge, Isaac Hayes, etc. Neither of these two spoke for the entire GOP. Ken Mehlman, as RNC chair, officially apologized for and renounced the "Southern Strategy" in 2005.
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Old 09-29-2013, 01:18 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 15,932,320 times
Reputation: 7968
Quote:
Originally Posted by katzpaw View Post
Post fail. The Southern Strategy was about about moving white southern voters to the Republican party - not moving Democrat Senators.

Southern strategy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I did like a couple quotes that I found in your link, so thank you for the link:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
A Lyndon B. Johnson ad called "Confessions of a Republican," which ran in the North, associated Goldwater with the Ku Klux Klan. At the same time, Johnson’s campaign in the Deep South publicized Goldwater’s support for pre-1964 civil rights legislation. In the end, Johnson swept the election.
We never seem to hear much about this. I guess you could say that Johnson had a "Northern/Southern strategy" that exploited racial division. But the GOP has never been as good as the Dems at devising catch phrases and spreading them to the four corners of the electorate.


I also was struck by this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
Writer Jeffrey Hart who worked on the Nixon campaign as a speechwriter says that Nixon did not have a "Southern Strategy" but "Border State Strategy" as the campaign ceded the Deep South to George Wallace and that the press merely call it a "Southern Strategy" as they are "very lazy".
That sounds about right, although I might substitute "disingenuous" for "lazy."
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Old 09-29-2013, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Boston, MA
13,635 posts, read 9,843,034 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katzpaw View Post
Post fail. The Southern Strategy was about about moving white southern voters to the Republican party - not moving Democrat Senators.

Southern strategy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Rich white southern voters.

The South was becoming much more prosperous and the Republican Party was going after them. That was what the Southern Strategy was.

Or you can believe Wiki which can be edited by my 4 year-old.
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Old 09-29-2013, 01:21 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,416 posts, read 18,674,123 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
If you've read any of the P&OC threads about race politics, you will have seen a meme spouted about the "Southern Strategy" and the shift of segregationists from the Democratic to the Republican party during the latter half of the 20th century.

In her excellent Mugged: Racial Demagoguery from the Seventies to Obama Ann Coulter dismantles this revisionism. For practical purposes, she says, the most important segregationists of the era were in the US Senate, "where civil rights bills went to die." She identifies 13 segregationist US Senators:

Harry Byrd Sr. (D, VA)
Robert Byrd (D, W VA)
Allen Ellender (D, LA)
Sam Ervin (D, NC)
Albert Gore Sr. (D, TN)
James Eastland (D, MS)
William Fulbright (D, AR)
Walter George (D, GA)
Ernest Hollings (D,SC)
Russell Long (D, LA)
Richard Russell (D, GA)
John Stennis (D, MS)
Strom Thurmond (D/R, SC)

Of these 13, exactly one switched parties from R to D. Strom Thurmond had been a Democrat until 1948, when he ran for president as a pro-segregation "DixieCrat" in 1948. As the name suggests, this was a splinter group from the Democratic party. Of course that bid failed, and Thurmond went back to being a Democrat, until he decided to switch parties again in 1964.

The others all stayed D for their entire careers. Most of them left the US Senate in the 1970's. A few were around as late as 1989 (John Stennis), 2005 (Ernest Hollings) and 2010 (Robert Byrd). Most were prototypical tax-and-spend Democrats in the mold of Robert Byrd. Sam Ervin in particular was a liberal icon for his role in the Watergate hearings.

There was no massive shift of segregationist Democrats to the Republican party in conjunction with a "Southern Strategy." Another moonbat meme is debunked by Ann Coulter.
It's true. The Democrats have been peddling a lot of revisionism latel. Propaganda is what they do best.
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Old 09-29-2013, 01:50 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 15,932,320 times
Reputation: 7968
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Joshua View Post
Rich white southern voters.

The South was becoming much more prosperous and the Republican Party was going after them. That was what the Southern Strategy was.

Or you can believe Wiki which can be edited by my 4 year-old.
Coulter kind of makes this point too. There were many changes besides race relations taking place during this era. For one thing, the Democratic party was changing dramatically, as shown by the nomination of McGovern in 1972. Or as Coulter puts it, the party "went insane" during this era. That did not play well in the South.

Nonetheless Democrats continued to have success in the South long after the purported Southern Strategy. Jimmy Carter swept the South in 1976. He even won Texas. Bill Clinton won 5 or 6 Southern states in 1992. As Coulter asks, does this prove that they were pandering to racists?
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Old 09-29-2013, 02:21 PM
 
4,130 posts, read 4,186,311 times
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Wait, so racists are all democrats?

She's been repeatedly denounced by Fox (and major conservatives pundits), several times, and even major industry funding sources for her bigotry. Is she a liberal?
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Old 09-29-2013, 02:42 PM
 
Location: Wasilla, Alaska
17,824 posts, read 21,790,640 times
Reputation: 6526
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
Coulter kind of makes this point too. There were many changes besides race relations taking place during this era. For one thing, the Democratic party was changing dramatically, as shown by the nomination of McGovern in 1972. Or as Coulter puts it, the party "went insane" during this era. That did not play well in the South.

Nonetheless Democrats continued to have success in the South long after the purported Southern Strategy. Jimmy Carter swept the South in 1976. He even won Texas. Bill Clinton won 5 or 6 Southern states in 1992. As Coulter asks, does this prove that they were pandering to racists?
The Dixiecrats final battle over segregation ended with Wallace in 1968. None of the Dixiecrat bigots in Congress became Republicans, despite the liberal myth to the contrary, they all died as ardent Democrats. What happened instead was the voters in those southern States got fed up with the Dixiecrat's bigotry and voted new Republican politicians into office instead. Republicans like Newt Gingrich, Trent Lott, Jesse Helms, Lamar Alexander, etc., etc.

This is why Nixon won the very same five southern States in 1972 that he lost to Wallace in 1968. It was a complete change in how people voted in the south. The Dixiecrats bigots were politically dead by 1972. This was also reflected in Congress with the passage of yet another Civil Rights bill (minus the Democrat filibuster this time) which Nixon signed into law, the Equal Employment Act of 1972.

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Old 09-29-2013, 03:27 PM
 
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 15,932,320 times
Reputation: 7968
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glitch View Post
The Dixiecrats final battle over segregation ended with Wallace in 1968. None of the Dixiecrat bigots in Congress became Republicans, despite the liberal myth to the contrary, they all died as ardent Democrats. What happened instead was the voters in those southern States got fed up with the Dixiecrat's bigotry and voted new Republican politicians into office instead. Republicans like Newt Gingrich, Trent Lott, Jesse Helms, Lamar Alexander, etc., etc.

This is why Nixon won the very same five southern States in 1972 that he lost to Wallace in 1968. It was a complete change in how people voted in the south. The Dixiecrats bigots were politically dead by 1972. This was also reflected in Congress with the passage of yet another Civil Rights bill (minus the Democrat filibuster this time) which Nixon signed into law, the Equal Employment Act of 1972.
Yeah Ann Coulter spends a fair amount of time on Southern voting patterns in her book. Pick it up, I think you would like it. It's not exactly a tour de force, but a good springboard.

As for Nixon, I have never been much of a fan of his, but he was an unsung hero when it came to the civil rights struggle. He pulled parliamentary tricks as VP under Ike (and thus pres of the Senate) to get the 1957 civil rights bill passed.

Here is some interesting history--an exchange of letters between MLK and RMN.
Letter from MLK to Vice President Nixon | The Martin Luther King Jr. Center for Nonviolent Social Change
Letter from Richard Nixon to MLK | The Martin Luther King Jr. Center for Nonviolent Social Change
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