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Old 10-07-2013, 05:51 PM
7,359 posts, read 5,102,940 times
Reputation: 3137


Originally Posted by Fiddlehead View Post
Because their narrative is usually just propaganda that serves a priviledged minority.
No, the propagandistic narrative is what you're spouting now. Republicans are for equal treatment for everyone. It's just Democrats keep up a narrative that Republicans are for the rich. We're not. We're for treating everyone the same.
They never seem to stand for the country as a whole.
We always stand for the country as a whole. It's you that divide the country up into different races, genders, and socioeconomic classes and want to use different policies for different people.
Also, I think a flaw in the conservative mindset is a fixation with tradition and the past.
It's a fixation on what is proper, not what is past. Do we have a fixation on putting Japanese into internment camps? No. Do we have a fixation on using children to labor in factories? No. Do we have a fixation on making alcohol illegal? No. Your theory is junk. We have a fixation on constitutional ideals, and the more you liberals try to get away from those ideas the more we have to fixate on the past. Like before government frisked anyone who wanted to get on a plane, expelled students for doodling a picture of a gun, used the IRS to target political enemies, kept records of private citizens' communications, told people what sort of insurance they must have, with-held drilling permits, borrowed billions of dollars from Chinese enemies, etc. The progress of progressives is progress towards debt and stagnation.
That is fine, even desirable to a degree, but such a view that all the right answers are already known makes them ill suited to leading into the future.
Some answers are already known. You give government too much power and government abuses it. History shows that quite clearly. But idiot liberals just want to keep giving government more and more power. Even when government is shown to be spying on people, assassinating Americans abroad without a trial, leaking peoples' private information, covering up an embassy attack, etc it doesn't faze people like you. You just want more and more government.
This is not always the case, because the left can certainly overreach. For example, the Reagan revolution had some basis.
It had a lot of basis, not some.
Taxes were high and government growth needed to be checked.
This has been true for a century.
However, he did not cut spending, and trickle down failed.
No, it didn't. It produced an economic boom. It's funny how liberals are always there to say nothing is Obama's fault, it's all the result of Bush's policies. But guess what the great Clinton years were a result of? Reagan's policies.
But, conservatives have kept serving that same medicine to every possible problem for 30 years, and now those Reaganesque ideas are absurdly innappropriate.
Now those ideas are more important than ever. We are trillions in debt and unemployment has stagnated at an unacceptably high level. People are being ordered what sort of health coverage they will have whether they like it or not. Schools are inculcating values to make children ashamed to be Americans. The country is as dependent as ever on oil produced by nations that hate freedom. Racial tensions are being enflamed by Democrats to secure votes, even as they do nothing to improve conditions in the inner cities.
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Old 10-07-2013, 05:56 PM
Location: Wisconsin
29,015 posts, read 16,897,912 times
Reputation: 9159
Originally Posted by Fiyero View Post
You do realize the OP said Right vs. Left, not Dem vs. Repub right? Southern Democrats were ultra right wing conservatives during the Civil Rights era.
And then after the passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, of all the segregationists how many of them became Republicans? Just one, all the rest of the most racist politicians remained Democrats.
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Old 10-07-2013, 05:57 PM
15,721 posts, read 10,822,805 times
Reputation: 6996
Originally Posted by Ghostly1 View Post
The fact that the question is asked that way shows me that the OP doesn't know his/her history or even what history is. The right may not be winning in the court of public opinion right now but that doesn't mean it's necessarily wrong. History is, by definition, always a look-back. It's made in the now but evaluated and graded in the future.

Might I suggest you study history a bit, especially eras during which the country flourished , the dollar was strong and the middle class thrived? Then link them to political affiliations of the administrations in office during those times.
Might I suggest you learn that political parties change? Republicans didn't always used to be raging right wingers. The OP said Right wing, not Republican.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:01 PM
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 15,929,734 times
Reputation: 7968
the left has often been on the wrong side of history.
The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression: Jean-Louis Panné, Andrzej Paczkowski, Karel Bartosek, Jean-Louis Margolin, Nicolas Werth, Stéphane Courtois, Mark Kramer, Jonathan Murphy: 9780674076082: Amazon.com: Books

The eugenics movement of the early 20th century progressive era, and their war on drugs & prostitution (Harrison Act and Mann Act), plus prohibition, which was a product of progressivism.

The right (individualism, esp Locke and Smith) was arguably largely responsible for the genesis of the American Revolution and the replacement of monarchy with democracy. In the meantime, the left was busy creating the USSR, Smersh, Red China, and reeducation camps.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:03 PM
15,721 posts, read 10,822,805 times
Reputation: 6996
Originally Posted by curly_Q View Post
If conservatives favor tradition, what is a more traditional institution than marriage? Liberals claim that marriage rights for LGBT (Lesbian, Gay, Bi, Transgender), is the civil rights issue of their generation, while at the same time refusing to acknowledge the importance of marriage for poor and minority babies born out of wedlock?
Marriage isn't all that traditional. And who said liberals aren't for marriage?

Also, when prayer was removed from public schools in the 1960s, did Christians take to the streets and riot and burn their own towns and cities as a form of protest, when a right was taken from them? No. If they don't like it, they pay taxes and then homeschool their children or send them to private schools.
They never had a right to pray in school using the government as a tool. Prayer in school on one's own is still perfectly legal.

Most conservatives just fall in line, salute, and move on once a decision has been made. They tend to be more respectful of hierarchy and authority, even if they don't agree.
No they don't.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:04 PM
Location: Old Bellevue, WA
18,782 posts, read 15,929,734 times
Reputation: 7968
Originally Posted by Fiyero View Post
You do realize the OP said Right vs. Left, not Dem vs. Repub right? Southern Democrats were ultra right wing conservatives during the Civil Rights era.
Actually no, they were liberals. William Fulbright, Sam Ervin, Robert Byrd, cases in point.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:09 PM
47,854 posts, read 20,687,361 times
Reputation: 11589
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC View Post
Ignorant post. It's all an illusion that you've been goaded into accepting. Those special glasses must have been a handout from Democrats, too.
Some of them actually believe there are NO dems involved with big business.

Or they just try to make us think it is only repubs.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:10 PM
Location: Ohio
23,193 posts, read 16,664,317 times
Reputation: 19782
Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
Any thoughts on why the right never seems to win in the end?
Leave it to NPR to rewrite history.

Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
This thought occurred to me as I was listening to NPR on the way to work. I mean, from workers' rights, women's rights,...
A Republican Governor signed the first bill into law permitting women to vote in the US.

The Ottoman Empire was one of the first to grant universal suffrage...so the Muslims were way ahead of 'Murica.

Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
....to Social Security,...
Um, at least 35 States had some form of Social Security, before FDR pulled a King Faisal/General Qasim/President Allende/Prime Minister Mossadeq/President Castro/President Arbenz (et al) and nationalized those programs into one gigantic disaster.

What, you thought FDR thought it up all by his lonesome self?

FDR wasn't that smart.

In fact, when FDR set up the Social Security program for New York State Residents when he was governor, he copied the Social Security plans of Republican Governors.

The federal government claims the "Poverty Level" is $11,490 for a single person in the US (excluding Hawaii and Alaska).

The problem with the federal government's claim is Reality™...because Poverty Level for 1 Person in Reality™ equals....

$6,038.85 per year in Cincinnati
21,861.80 per year in San Fransisco

And those two cities are neither the cheapest in the US, nor the most expensive in the US.

So, this is the stupidity that FDR gave you.....we will compare San Fransisco with Cincinnati.

Two people, each receiving $1,100/month in Social Security Disability or Retirement....

equals $2092.95 per month in Cincinnati
equals $761.07. per month in San Fransisco

....due to the differences in Cost-of Living and Purchasing Power.

Does everyone now see just how freaking disturbed Liberals really are?

Are you patting yourself on the back for the distress and harm you're causing? Well, if you hurt yourself whilst patting yourself on the back, at least you got O-Care and someone else to pay.

Can you justify that?

I already know you won't respond.......I've been espouse the aforementioned facts for nearly a year and not one Liberal has the courage to step up and meet the challenge.

Maybe you can prove to me that Liberals do have courage and be the first to explain to C-D Forum members how wonderful it is that someone in Cincinnati is getting over like fat rat on Social Security, while one in San Fransisco suffers....

....and all because FDR usurped and violated the Constitution.

And guess what......the CPI is currently tracking to give a 1.5% COLA increase to Social Security recipients.

Yeah, that really makes a lot of sense.....give a 1.5% increase to someone who lives in a region or area of the US were the CPI has been declining, and then screw over someone in an area where the CPI has been flying through the roof.

You Liberals must be proud of yourselves.....but, hey, if people have to suffer so you can promulgate your differently twisted agenda, have at it.

Wanna talk about Food Stamps?

Two families of four each receiving $400/month in Food Stamps except that $400 buys....

$578.13 worth of food in Cincinnati.
$210.23 worth of food in San Fransisco

....due to the differences in Cost-of Living and Purchasing Power.

I know that's got to give you a warm fuzzing tingling sensation in your tummy.

Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
Civil Rights, Voting Rights,....
Um, it was the Democrats who filibustered the Civil Rights Acts written by Republicans.

I'm guessing NPR conveniently forgot to tell you how Dr King met with Ike and was thrilled that the Republicans were heavily pushing numerous Civil Rights and Voting Reforms....

....only to see Democrats in the Senate reading every line of every page from the telephone book to filibuster and stop the vote.

Oh, you don't remember that? I guess not.

And then after the idiot JFK assumed power, the Democrats did it again....stopped a vote on the Civil Rights Act.

You think the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was cool?

If it hadn't been for the Democrats, you'd have had the same thing 6 years earlier in 1958.

Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
... Medicare,....
Wow, your history is appallingly weak....read...

Introduced by various House and Senate sponsors and subject to extensive hearings, the basic framework of part A began to reflect accommodations between the sponsors, the Administration and the American Hospital Association (AHA).

It ranged all the way from principles of institutional reimbursement, which has been pretty thoroughly already worked out in a general way for their own purposes between Blue Cross and the Hospital Association over a period of several years

The American Hospital Association has already nominated the Blue Cross organization for its membership, although some member hospitals will undoubtedly elect out of this arrangement. We have proceeded very far in the development of working arrangements with Blue Cross, although no formal approval as a fiscal intermediary has yet been given them.

Source: Report to Social Security Administration Staff on the Implementation of the Social Security Amendments of 1965, Robert M. Ball Commissioner, November 15, 1965

How's that working out for everyone?

So....the American Hospital Association groups member hospitals together in an attempt to stifle competition in the health care industry by putting non-member hospitals out of business, and to do that, creates the "Out-of-Network" clause seriously harming you and all other Americans, then lobbies the State legislatures for "enabling laws" to avoid being regulated by State insurance commissions, and simultaneoysly corner the health insurance market when the American Hospital Association creates the first health insurance company in 1946 --- the Blue Cross.....and then helps steer health care coverage to the employers, then lobbies Congress and the IRS to change the 1954 IRS Tax Code to screw all Americans and then.....

....because thanks to the lobbyists at the American Hospital Association, you can only get health plan coverage through your employer.....but look.....

The American Hospital Association has already nominated the Blue Cross organization ...

....wow, there they are......Johnny-on-the-Spot ready to solve the very problem that they created in the first place.

How freaking convenient.

Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
... and now the Affordable Care Act,...
A misnomer....since it is not affordable.

Check it out....

Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
The ACA increases costs, but it does not reduce them.

See this....

  • Under the law, lifetime limits on most benefits are prohibited in any health plan or insurance policy issued or renewed on or after September 23, 2010.
  • No annual dollar limits are allowed on most covered benefits beginning January 1, 2014.
Source: Lifetime & Annual Limits | HealthCare.gov

....you can attempt to impress all of us by explaining how much "Unlimited" costs.

So....how much does "Unlimited" cost?

Can we get an answer on that?

I'm going to keep asking the question until one of you gets the courage to answer.

I guess that will never happen.

I've explained the Economics behind it....I'm not surprised none of you understand....after all....it's an Economic Thing.

Can you answer the burning question, "How much does 'Unlimited' Cost?"

Originally Posted by mackinac81 View Post
And then they also lose in the court of public opinion. It's an interesting phenomenon.
What's really interesting is why the Obama Administration has been lying from the very beginning.

When the "court of public opinion" gets the actual bill for Obamacare, we'll see who's laughing, because the "court of public opinion" is very fickle....especially when you withhold the truth from them.

The Right Side.....

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Old 10-07-2013, 06:10 PM
Location: Pluto's Home Town
9,986 posts, read 12,754,976 times
Reputation: 5668
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC View Post
The government teet.....free money....free services....handouts galore. That's what liberals are known for. "If it's free, it's for me!"

The increase in big government over the last 100 years is directly proportional to the dumbing down of our citizenry. You folks are a natural fit for the Big Government Age. Thankfully, we have conservatives to counter those measures....otherwise we would have been the Banana Republic that liberals are hoping to achieve long before now.
This dog won't hunt. Compare a nice progressive state, like Massachussetts, with a nice conservative state, like Oklahoma. I don't think the progressive states are any dumber. And I bet there are as many people on the welfare teet in red states as blue states.
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Old 10-07-2013, 06:12 PM
19,023 posts, read 24,225,018 times
Reputation: 7350
Originally Posted by Fiyero View Post
You do realize the OP said Right vs. Left, not Dem vs. Repub right? Southern Democrats were ultra right wing conservatives during the Civil Rights era.
And liberals used to be about Liberty not banning every little last Freedom
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