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Old 11-21-2013, 12:25 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,892 posts, read 16,080,363 times
Reputation: 3954

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Delahanty View Post
It wouldn't be important if it didn't reflect a pattern of behavior. It's not the first time he's omitted references to God, most notably when he's curiously omitted the "Creator" when referencing the Declaration of Independence.
For it to be part of "a pattern," it would have had to actually happen.
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Old 11-21-2013, 01:07 PM
 
Location: Boston, MA
14,483 posts, read 11,285,313 times
Reputation: 9002
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
If it wasn't in the rough draft, and Mr Burns asked President Obama to read the rough draft, and President read the rough draft AS IT WAS WRITTEN, then President Obama didn't edit anything out.

President Obama didn't alter the words. He read what was written. The fact that some of you HATE him so much that you are unable to comprehend the simplest of facts is what is ridiculous.
What the hell are you talking about? Who the hell is Mr. Burns?
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Old 11-21-2013, 01:25 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,892 posts, read 16,080,363 times
Reputation: 3954
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Joshua View Post
What the hell are you talking about? Who the hell is Mr. Burns?
Ken Burns... the documentarian who asked Obama to read the address for his film.

Lincoln wrote out 5 known copies of the address in his own hand. Two of them (both the ones he wrote out before giving the address) do not contain the words "under God." Only the three copies he made (for fundraising purposes) in 1864 contain the phrase.

There is no way of knowing whether or not he said them when he actually gave the address.
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Old 11-21-2013, 01:35 PM
 
42,732 posts, read 29,884,155 times
Reputation: 14345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Joshua View Post
What the hell are you talking about? Who the hell is Mr. Burns?
Mr Burns is Ken Burns, the historian. Mr Burns was working on a production about the Gettysburg Address. As part of that project, he asked various people, celebrities, politicians, writers, etc, to read the Gettysburg Address while being filmed. As part of that project, Mr Burns asked President Obama to read the original draft of the Gettysburg Address as written by President Lincoln. The first two versions of the Gettysburg Address, did not include the words, "under God." Neither were they identical, as is the nature of drafts. President Lincoln went on to handwrite three other copies of the Gettysburg Address. There are five versions in the President's handwriting. None are identical to the other.

The draft that Mr Burns asked Mr Obama to read is the draft that many historians believe President Lincoln carried with him to the lectern to read from. It is likely that President Lincoln continued editing his speech as he spoke, something most great speakers do, because there is a relationship between the speaker and the audience, and that relationship requires adjustments.

Since we had no devices capable of recording President Lincoln, we have no "actual" version of his speech. We have five variants in his own handwriting, and several more variants from people who actually attended the speech. I think it's quite likely that he added the words, "under God" to his speech, as he spoke, because the words themselves suited the occasion, and because Lincoln was a wordsmith, the added syllables actually lend themselves to the rhythm of the speech.

However, Mr Burns did not ask President Obama to mimic President Lincoln, or to try to recite it the way President Lincoln did. Mr Burns asked President Obama to read President Lincoln's first draft of the speech. Which is what President Obama did, word for word, exactly as President Lincoln wrote it.
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Old 11-21-2013, 02:03 PM
 
Location: Boston, MA
14,483 posts, read 11,285,313 times
Reputation: 9002
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
Mr Burns is Ken Burns, the historian. Mr Burns was working on a production about the Gettysburg Address. As part of that project, he asked various people, celebrities, politicians, writers, etc, to read the Gettysburg Address while being filmed. As part of that project, Mr Burns asked President Obama to read the original draft of the Gettysburg Address as written by President Lincoln. The first two versions of the Gettysburg Address, did not include the words, "under God." Neither were they identical, as is the nature of drafts. President Lincoln went on to handwrite three other copies of the Gettysburg Address. There are five versions in the President's handwriting. None are identical to the other.

The draft that Mr Burns asked Mr Obama to read is the draft that many historians believe President Lincoln carried with him to the lectern to read from. It is likely that President Lincoln continued editing his speech as he spoke, something most great speakers do, because there is a relationship between the speaker and the audience, and that relationship requires adjustments.

Since we had no devices capable of recording President Lincoln, we have no "actual" version of his speech. We have five variants in his own handwriting, and several more variants from people who actually attended the speech. I think it's quite likely that he added the words, "under God" to his speech, as he spoke, because the words themselves suited the occasion, and because Lincoln was a wordsmith, the added syllables actually lend themselves to the rhythm of the speech.

However, Mr Burns did not ask President Obama to mimic President Lincoln, or to try to recite it the way President Lincoln did. Mr Burns asked President Obama to read President Lincoln's first draft of the speech. Which is what President Obama did, word for word, exactly as President Lincoln wrote it.
These are the drafts:

http://www.gettysburgfoundation.org/41

Last edited by Mr. Joshua; 11-21-2013 at 02:11 PM..
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Old 11-21-2013, 02:24 PM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,706,970 times
Reputation: 14818
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Joshua View Post
These are the drafts:

Gettysburg Visitor Center
The President read the Nicolay copy, word for word.

http://www.learntheaddress.org/
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Old 11-21-2013, 04:17 PM
 
23,654 posts, read 17,514,296 times
Reputation: 7472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
Who gives a ****? Lincoln expanded government to such a level that it made the current over abuse of executive power possible.

Lincoln ignored the supreme court, a equal branch of Government.

Lincoln nationalized public property.

Lincoln was a bad president. He is not a president to honor or appreciate.

If you like small government, Lincoln is your Jimmy Carter
You must be related to that good ole Dem boy, George Wallace.
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Old 11-21-2013, 05:50 PM
 
Location: 500 miles from home
33,942 posts, read 22,532,112 times
Reputation: 25816
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Joshua View Post
It doesn't matter what was in the rough drafts. Lincoln thought it was important to include it, Barack Obama thought it was important to edit it out. His desire not to offend anyone is ridiculous and inaccurate. The words weren't his to alter.
That is absolutely false. He read the version of the address that he was GIVEN to read.

Period. End of story.

Righties should really stop trying to turn this into another Obama hate fest. It really only makes you appear silly and people are less likely to listen to your litany of complaints in the future.
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Old 11-21-2013, 05:56 PM
 
Location: San Francisco, CA
15,088 posts, read 13,452,870 times
Reputation: 14266
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
With no emotion whatsoever, almost a monotone, Obama recites the Gettysburg Address ... and leaves out "under God." I have never heard such a poor, unemotional recitation in my entire life. Positively awful! And why did he leave out "under God?" Was this for "political correctness" in deference to Muslims? One has to wonder. After all, this is the man who likes to talk about all the wonderful contributions of Muslims in America (like, 9-11?)!

Video: Obama Removes 'Under God' From Gettysburg Address
Conservatives need to stop being so scared of all Muslims. Not all Muslims are terrorists; in fact, most aren't. Most Muslim Americans just want to live in peace and be free to practice their religion as anyone else is free to practice theirs. Judging all Muslims on the basis of what two dozen or so of them did one day is rather stupid. It makes about as much sense as imprisoning all Japanese Americans after Pearl Harbor. And recognizing that most Muslims should be treated with respect doesn't mean that we can't be tough and vigilant against those who are a real threat.

If conservatives could evolve some intellect that allows them to distinguish shades of gray rather than see everything in the black-white perspective of a grade schooler, they might be taken more seriously.
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Old 11-22-2013, 10:18 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,868 posts, read 24,392,645 times
Reputation: 8672
Quote:
Originally Posted by janelle144 View Post
You must be related to that good ole Dem boy, George Wallace.
No. I read a history book
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