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I just read this article the other day and found it kind of interesting. Although I understand that being poor can be tough to come out of, I felt that the woman who wrote this article just felt sorry for herself. She basically said that she's poor and that's all she'll ever be. What kind of attitude is that? I find it really sad that she has this mindset.
I also don't understand why poor people keep having kids. It makes no sense to me.
It seems like this women is a hard worker.. after all, she works two jobs and goes to school. But she just seems so hopeless and it's really sad. What does everyone think?
Try reading it here: Why I Make Terrible Decisions, or, poverty thoughts, her posting. Also read the comments (many with the same shallow criticisms you'll see on C-D and elsewhere) and her responses. They clarify a lot.
What really bothers me is the media message out there that they should be unhappy because they don't have a lot of toys and trinkets.
That makes me crazy.
And they totally buy into it and let it make them sad. Or make stupid decisions and buy the crap thinking it will make them happy.
Excuse me but 70% of GDP is based upon consumer spending as a result we are all inundated with advertisements telling us that this or that widget, bauble or widget will transform our lives and makes us all infinitely more happy and prestigious if we acquire them, and sense those who are rich and affluent buy into the message so completely why do we think the poor would be immune?
I've read threads on this forum where affluent individuals have made value judgements about others based upon what freaking designer handbags they have. So if one's esteem is judged by what car one drives, how big one's home maybe, or what toys and trinkets one possesses why would we think that individuals who are held in low esteem by the greater society would not seek to improve their self-esteem by inappropriately aping the conspicuous consumption of their "betters?"
As a society we castigate some poor kid for buying $200.00 sneakers while at the same time multi-millionaires (Yes you Michael, LeBron and Kobe, I'm talking about you) take every opportunity to flaunt these shoes and the status the are suppose to confer in the face of some poor kid who by hook or by crook gets $200.00 to buy them. Yes, we can lament that this kid should take his $200.00 and save it for college, but when the idea of saving $200.00 today in order to pay $20,000 in tuition at some point in future in order to realize some vague notion or desire that they might actually be admitted to a college it isn't that hard to see why the wrong choice is often made.
I've written before about how we do not value the worth of common working people and the overvaluation of the rich and famous, until we find a way to value the productive efforts of all of our citizens, we will be confronted with the skewed value system that leads the poor, and the rich I might add, from making choices that are deleterious to our society.
We need to distinguish between patently counterproductive behavior such as smoking and drug use, pigging out on junkfood, unplanned pregnancies and serial one-night-stands, with blasé fatalism. Go-getter Pollyanna stridency isn’t necessary for success, let alone for emerging from desperate circumstances. Neither is it sufficient. What is necessary is avoiding a few key blunders. That is doubtless more difficult to do when every day is a struggle and judgment is clouded by immediate imperatives. But I say again that the antidote is not ebullient optimism. Instead, it’s a kind of circumspection and risk-avoidance.
I’m not persuaded that the prototypical mindset of modern American poverty is fatalism, let alone pessimism. A pessimist would actively avoid procreating, because bringing more children into the world sentences new humans to new hardships. A pessimist wouldn’t take up smoking, since that is yet another struggle (how to afford cigarettes, how to fit smoking-breaks into one’s day) and another new endeavor, and novelty merely leads to more complications. What I think motivates the poor – if “the poor” could be lumped into one monolithic cohort, which is unlikely – is a desire to escape, to colorize the bleakness. That escape might be costly and traumatic, but at least it’s something enjoyable, however briefly. Fatalists would say that searching for such joys is stupid, because if one is fated to enjoy them, they shall arrive of their own accord, but if it’s not fated to enjoy them, then no individual effort could bring them about.
The desire to escape is not limited to the poor. It also affects the middle class. But the middle class can afford the escapism. It can afford the vacations and the electronic gadgets and fancy cars and so forth, until one day it no longer can. This is what we call sliding down the socioeconomic scale.
I would argue that rather than trying to engender entrepreneurial spunk, we would be more successful by embracing the ultimate idiocy and capriciousness of life. The less we desire, the less liable we are to fail. And non-failure is the surest success.
Excuse me but 70% of GDP is based upon consumer spending as a result we are all inundated with advertisements telling us that this or that widget, bauble or widget will transform our lives and makes us all infinitely more happy and prestigious if we acquire them, and sense those who are rich and affluent buy into the message so completely why do we think the poor would be immune?
I've read threads on this forum where affluent individuals have made value judgements about others based upon what freaking designer handbags they have. So if one's esteem is judged by what car one drives, how big one's home maybe, or what toys and trinkets one possesses why would we think that individuals who are held in low esteem by the greater society would not seek to improve their self-esteem by inappropriately aping the conspicuous consumption of their "betters?"
As a society we castigate some poor kid for buying $200.00 sneakers while at the same time multi-millionaires (Yes you Michael, LeBron and Kobe, I'm talking about you) take every opportunity to flaunt these shoes and the status the are suppose to confer in the face of some poor kid who by hook or by crook gets $200.00 to buy them. Yes, we can lament that this kid should take his $200.00 and save it for college, but when the idea of saving $200.00 today in order to pay $20,000 in tuition at some point in future in order to realize some vague notion or desire that they might actually be admitted to a college it isn't that hard to see why the wrong choice is often made.
I've written before about how we do not value the worth of common working people and the overvaluation of the rich and famous, until we find a way to value the productive efforts of all of our citizens, we will be confronted with the skewed value system that leads the poor, and the rich I might add, from making choices that are deleterious to our society.
I just read this article the other day and found it kind of interesting. Although I understand that being poor can be tough to come out of, I felt that the woman who wrote this article just felt sorry for herself. She basically said that she's poor and that's all she'll ever be. What kind of attitude is that? I find it really sad that she has this mindset.
I also don't understand why poor people keep having kids. It makes no sense to me.
It seems like this women is a hard worker.. after all, she works two jobs and goes to school. But she just seems so hopeless and it's really sad. What does everyone think?
My first thought was ...nice that she can squeeze "longer than an hour" in with her kids on the weekend..they must miss her in the week.
That's HER choice though...I don't know if she's congratulating herself, or asking for mercy...She sounds beaten down to me.
I really don't like the way this woman uses the word "we" when she speaks of the poor. What she's described is not a "we" at all...it's a "her".
That's very true...but there is actually more free/cheap things to do in big cities than you think. Chicago, for example, has a great public transportation system. There are certain days of the week when you go to the museums and aquarium for free. There is also a big lake that you can swim in for free.
I must not be like most people because I have no urge to procreate. Children are just too expensive in this economy and lead to more stress. I will never understand how someone who doesn't have two nickels to rub together can just have children.
This. I was getting into it with somebody a couple of days ago about procreation. I am 26 years old and have been slowly working my way up the career ladder. 2 years ago I had no house, a car in p*** poor shape, barely any possessions, and $200 to my name. Now I'm doing infinitely better because I had the strive to change my situation.
I currently make well over minimum wage, and I have yet to have children because I currently have no savings (still catching up from being broke, but I do have my own house, transportation, and a full time job), and I understand that having some level of financial stability should be a requirement for starting a family. Yes, all people have the right to procreate, but that doesn't make them automatically entitled to pump out children left and right just because they CAN. If somebody is dirt poor and want to have children, they should first set their sights on something bigger, if they have any hope of their offspring getting off their feet and making something of themselves.
I have no problem helping the needy, but why on earth would I want any of my tax dollars going to parents who have no self control and no drive to make something of themselves before having kids. My soon to be sister-in-law is about to have her second kid, guaranteed to be paid for completely by government money just like the first (who is now almost two and I doubt a dollar has been earned/spent by the parents to raise her), because her and her boyfriend simply don't even try to find work. I bust my a** for what I have, and just don't see how others can procreate repeatedly when they're broke. I have nothing against people with a lower income, but if they have a mentality like my sister-in law and her boyfriend, it's no wonder why they stay poor.
Last edited by BlerntForceTrauma; 11-27-2013 at 04:58 PM..
This. I was getting into it with somebody a couple of days ago about procreation. I am 26 years old and have been slowly working my way up the career ladder. 2 years ago I had no house, a car in p*** poor shape, barely any possessions, and $200 to my name. Now I'm doing infinitely better because I had the strive to change my situation.
I currently make well over minimum wage, and I have yet to have children because I currently have no savings (still catching up from being broke, but I do have my own house, transportation, and a full time job), and I understand that having some level of financial stability should be a requirement for starting a family. Yes, all people have the right to procreate, but that doesn't make them automatically entitled to pump out children left and right just because they CAN. If somebody is dirt poor and want to have children, they should first set their sights on something bigger, if they have any hope of their offspring getting off their feet and making something of themselves.
I have no problem helping the needy, but why on earth would I want any of my tax dollars going to parents who have no self control and no drive to make something of themselves before having kids. My soon to be sister-in-law is about to have her second kid, guaranteed to be paid for completely by government money just like the first (who is now almost two and I doubt a dollar has been earned/spent by the parents to raise her), because her and her boyfriend simply don't even try to find work. I bust my a** for what I have, and just don't see how others can procreate repeatedly when they're broke. I have nothing against people with a lower income, but if they have a mentality like my sister-in law and her boyfriend, it's no wonder why they stay poor.
Yup. It really makes me wonder if these people are truly having kids on purpose or are too stupid to figure out how birth control works. I'm around your age and a girl I went to school with recently had her fifth kid.. I couldn't imagine having one. And so many people make the excuse that birth control always fails for them. It's more than 99 percent effective, so I'm thinking that odds aren't against you.
"None of it matters. We don't plan long-term because if we do we'll just get our hearts broken. It's best not to hope. You just take what you can get as you spot it." - Linda Tirado
There's the problem. It's all about attitude. Life is what you make of it. It will get worse if you plan on it. People not only fail to plan but plan to fail. I have lived all three classes poor, middle and rich. I use to be homeless years ago but if I thought the way she did I wouldn't be as successful today. There is hope. There are so many resources out there...well SF isn't one of the most affordable places grant you but there are cheaper alternative places to go to. My sister was in a similar situation but she didn't give up because it Does Matter. Her kids matter enough to drive her to success. My advise no more self defeating thoughts and make changes to realistic goals to help you take each small step to the main objective.
This.
If you believe you can do better (get a better job / higher paycheck / education, anything), you will achieve it.
Having grown up poor, I agree with you. Everybody makes poor decisions in their lives. Everybody has bad things happen to them through no fault of their own. Poor people who "make it" don't let mistakes or bad luck keep them from trying to better themselves. They have optimistic, "the glass is half full", views of the world and tend to think long term.
Almost invariably, poor people who remain poor and pass their poverty on to their children have pessimistic, negative, almost fatalistic, views of the world. They can't see themselves as successful, so they don't try, passing on opportunities because they have to leave their comfort zones. When life deals them one bad blow, they curl up into a fetal position and wait for the next one they know will follow. They give in rather than fight back. That's the author's attitude, and on one level, it seems like a lot of excuse-making to me, but I don't think it's deliberate, and I don't think it's something that the author can change. I think that people are "wired" to be pessimists/optimists or fighters/accepters just as they "wired" to be lots of other things, and, unfortunately, it's not something one can change.
If some people with drug addictions can change anything is possible. I don't know the author personally so can't really say what her true potential is. I've been poor but keep in mind some of the richest people grew up in poor families. When it comes to poor people there are too many variables. Some can and some can't but we shouldn't generalize a whole class because of genetics. If that were the case I wouldn't be able to know what the other two classes were like. I started poor but my genetics didn't keep me there.
If you believe you can do better (get a better job / higher paycheck / education, anything), you will achieve it.
Absolutely!! I was told I wouldn't amount to anything when I was younger but they were wrong. I was homeless feeling the lowest of low having nothing. I lost everything twice in my life. I learned about the stories of other successful people and thought if they can do it so can I. Michael Jordan didn't make the basketball team in high school because they underestimated him. Dave Thomas dropped out of high school but was the founder of Wendy's. If you believe you will. I like that
I weighed 324 lbs last year. I lost 80 lbs since them going from being a bubble to muscles like a body builder. I did it because I believe. I proudly wear my Nike shirt "JUST DO IT".
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