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Old 01-09-2014, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Wasilla, Alaska
17,823 posts, read 23,442,152 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
It's the little injuries, the microfractures and microtears that happen with almost any exertion--that heal very quickly in young males that don't heal nearly as quickly for females and older males.

It's the reason young male bodybuilders can work to extreme limits with a day or two of rest between workouts and grow muscle, while an older male or woman on the same regimen will actually grow weaker and have injuries.
I am not saying your are wrong, I have no data either way on the subject. However, I do not understand why women would not heal just as rapidly as men with the exact same injury. I can understand how women might become injured more often than men, but to take longer to recuperate? I need to see evidence of that before I will believe it.
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Old 04-07-2014, 10:20 PM
 
Location: San Marcos
55 posts, read 41,486 times
Reputation: 33
Okay... There are several reasons that a female should not be allowed to become combatants alongside males. I have served as a Marine and under went a highly kinetic deployment to Afghanistan. So I can speak from on an experiential level and not merely a theoretic one.

First and foremost being in a combat zone degrades the moral fabric of every human being by challenging what leading psychologist call "the just world belief". In a sense we become base creatures. This is a proven fact because of the freeze, flight, or fight response that is a product of the amygdala and the hippocampus region of the brain. Basically the brain goes into survival mode and starts pumping adrenaline and cortisal throughout the body, increasing heart rate, blood flow to the muscles, and opens the lung up to receive more oxygen.

Our body has natural regulators that govern the amount of adrenaline and cortisal that are pumped into the body. An extreme combat situation can destroy this internal thermostat, which is the main reason for the anger and irritation that goes is a known product of PTSD. Females already have a lot going on regulating hormones inside their body once every month, throw in Post Traumatic Stress and you have a very volatile mixture. Not to mention Traumatic Brain Injury that comes from the concussive blast of Improvised Explosive Devices or Rocket Propelled Grenades. Some damage created from TBI is irreversible because of the axions that snap inside the outer layer of the brain. A by product to add to PTSD is insomnia and irritation. Women already have enough to deal with every month, that would push someone to the breaking point.

There is also the factor of being reduced to base creatures, under going immense combat stress, and being in country for an extended period. Human beings will be human beings and seek the comfort of those around them. Basically men and women alike will find a way to physically ease there stress, especially after moral erosion. I have heard of to many co ed units issuing Non-Judicial Punishments out for infidelity during deployment. Not to mention females getting shipped back for becoming pregnant during deployment. This totally compromises mission readiness, presents a grievous logistical challenge, and the unneeded allocation of wartime resources.

You must also factor in man's primordial nature to protect his female counter-part. Whether they are physically involved or not, men have the natural urge to protect the female at all cost, by instinct. This instinctual urge does not make it fair on the battlefield at all and actually clouds sound judgement and the decision making process.

All in all, females should not be allowed to participate as combatants not merely because of their flaw, but because man's flaws as well. Flaws that are a by product of human nature. No matter how much we try to fight it there is still that chance. In war we should not risk the lives of fellow service members, men and women alike. As service members of this country, we should focus on defending the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic. We do this by excelling on the field of battle....
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Old 04-07-2014, 10:47 PM
 
Location: Newport Beach, California
39,208 posts, read 27,575,665 times
Reputation: 16046
David,

I am wondering if I can ask you several questions regarding this topic.

1. When my brother was in the Marine Corps, I think he went through something called gold wing pinning ceremony, I know now the ceremony is looked down upon because it is called "hazing."

I really appreciate and love the Marine Corps culture personally, but do you think the male dominate hardcore Marine Corps culture creates the toughest climate for a woman to enter and succeed in?

2. Officials with the Marine Corps said they won’t lower physical standards for combat troops to accommodate women. In reality, do you believe this is even possible? In your opinion, do you believe the services might adjust requirements to make it easier to integrate units?


Thank you in advance.
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Old 04-07-2014, 11:03 PM
 
Location: San Marcos
55 posts, read 41,486 times
Reputation: 33
Lily,

To theoretically answer your first question (because I have never witnessed nor partook an any form of hazing, just read about it through various sources), although important, the Gold Wing pinning ceremony, in the terms of punching the pin into your chest, is supposedly commonplace in the early Marine Corps. The fact is that POG-ass air wingers got their wings beat into them, and every rank an enlisted person received got beat into their collar bone. Hell, I heard of one guy that got it logged in there and the Marines had to pull it out with a Leatherman. That's not to degrade your brother, because not every Marine is able to go to jump school, but just saying it was more commonplace than you think. In my opinion "Blood Stripes" were worse.

To answer your second question DEFINITELY! The idea of a co ed combat unit is more than a few years old. To be hosest with you Marines actually laughed at the very idea. Now, it has became less of a military issue of mission effectiveness,and more of an issue of politics. No matter what, politicians will ALWAYS have their way with the military. I mean the top tier individuals of military chain of command are all politicians.

I hope I answered your questions sufficiently?
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Old 04-07-2014, 11:06 PM
 
Location: Newport Beach, California
39,208 posts, read 27,575,665 times
Reputation: 16046
Quote:
Originally Posted by HARDKORE0811 View Post
Lily,

To theoretically answer your first question (because I have never witnessed nor partook an any form of hazing, just read about it through various sources), although important, the Gold Wing pinning ceremony, in the terms of punching the pin into your chest, is supposedly commonplace in the early Marine Corps. The fact is that POG-ass air wingers got their wings beat into them, and every rank an enlisted person received got beat into their collar bone. Hell, I heard of one guy that got it logged in there and the Marines had to pull it out with a Leatherman. That's not to degrade your brother, because not every Marine is able to go to jump school, but just saying it was more commonplace than you think. In my opinion "Blood Stripes" were worse.

To answer your second question DEFINITELY! The idea of a co ed combat unit is more than a few years old. To be hosest with you Marines actually laughed at the very idea. Now, it has became less of a military issue of mission effectiveness,and more of an issue of politics. No matter what, politicians will ALWAYS have their way with the military. I mean the top tier individuals of military chain of command are all politicians.

I hope I answered your questions sufficiently?

Yes, thank you so much. I hope you are enjoying Marine Corps Semper Fi.
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Old 04-07-2014, 11:23 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,647 posts, read 26,363,905 times
Reputation: 12648
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalbound12 View Post
This isn't news, they have never been required to do a pull up. They do a "flexed arm hang" or something. The thing is, men only have to do 3 pull ups to pass the PT test.

I do believe if women are going to serve in combat they should have to pass the exact same standards as a man. Some women are capable of combat roles but in order to find them we should hold them to identical standards.


Men only have to do three pull-ups to pass that particular portion of the PFT.

Fail any part of the test (pull-ups, sit-ups or the three mile run) and you fail it all.


"Some women are capable of combat roles"



Never met one.
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Old 04-07-2014, 11:56 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,647 posts, read 26,363,905 times
Reputation: 12648
Quote:
Originally Posted by southbel View Post
Agree completely. Quite true too about the PFT. Goal for everyone is generally always a perfect score.



We're not sending people into foreign nations to take a PFT.

When I was in, I weighed 180-184lbs.

I hauled 80-100lbs of gear that added another 50% to my total weight.

A 120lb female has exactly half the muscle mass of a 180lb male and a skeletal structure that isn't up to the task.

When we add the same 80-100lbs to her, we just doubled the load she has to carry.

I realize that an all-male war machine protecting the nation is a giant **** sandwich that every man hating radical feminist has to eat, but get a clue people!

The reason why males age 18-20 are the ones to fight our wars is because they can build muscle faster than any other group and have the best backs and knees for enduring the physical demands of service within a grunt unit.

If you haven't done it, then you don't know.
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Old 04-08-2014, 12:20 AM
 
Location: Newport Beach, California
39,208 posts, read 27,575,665 times
Reputation: 16046
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Men only have to do three pull-ups to pass that particular portion of the PFT.

Fail any part of the test (pull-ups, sit-ups or the three mile run) and you fail it all.


"Some women are capable of combat roles"



Never met one.
Yeah, my brother's co said, "If a woman claims that she can do our job (Recon), she should get her chromosome checked"

I think Marine Corps unique culture creates a very tough climate for a woman to be successful. Honestly, I have never met a Marine in real life who is not.. Hardcore.
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Old 04-08-2014, 02:05 AM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,647 posts, read 26,363,905 times
Reputation: 12648
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
It cannot be done on a linear basis but they will do it nevertheless because decades of "Men better; Women inferior", programming have indoctrinated them thusly.

In this particular case women are inferior.
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Old 04-08-2014, 05:50 AM
 
28,662 posts, read 18,764,698 times
Reputation: 30933
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
We're not sending people into foreign nations to take a PFT.

When I was in, I weighed 180-184lbs.

I hauled 80-100lbs of gear that added another 50% to my total weight.

A 120lb female has exactly half the muscle mass of a 180lb male and a skeletal structure that isn't up to the task.

When we add the same 80-100lbs to her, we just doubled the load she has to carry.

I realize that an all-male war machine protecting the nation is a giant **** sandwich that every man hating radical feminist has to eat, but get a clue people!

The reason why males age 18-20 are the ones to fight our wars is because they can build muscle faster than any other group and have the best backs and knees for enduring the physical demands of service within a grunt unit.

If you haven't done it, then you don't know.
We have volumes and volumes of decades of sports medicine data--and military medicine data as well, that proves all this out.

But women can fly drones and launch missiles--no problem. And those are "combatant" operations.
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