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View Poll Results: Would raising the minimum wage to $15/hr create jobs and revive the economy?
YES. I am all for it seeing how it would benefit everybody 24 20.69%
NO. I am against it because (please elaborate) 83 71.55%
I don't know / don't care 9 7.76%
Voters: 116. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-21-2014, 07:58 AM
 
804 posts, read 619,986 times
Reputation: 156

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That only applies to those making widget and even then nobody knows the value of said widget until they are sold. But what about the value of labor of a doctor, etcher, research scientist? How do you calculate that? Lol

I tell you bud, leave economics to people with better analytical skills....




Quote:
Originally Posted by pnwmdk View Post
No, it isn't.

The value of labor is amount of value the action creates.

If you make 10 widgets an hour, and your labor turns 10 dollars worth of parts into a 20 dollar dollar widget, the value of your labor is 100 dollars.

Work out the value of making a sub sandwich for us. Oh, and also tell us what portion of the value of that labor goes to profit, capital funding, expenses, debt service, taxes, mandates, etc.

I mean, with your superior intellect and all, you must have that information at your fingertips, since you seem to be so adamant of your right to tell others what they must do.

 
Old 02-21-2014, 08:01 AM
PJA
 
2,462 posts, read 3,183,481 times
Reputation: 1223
A lot of companies wouldn't be able to afford to pay this meaning they would be forced to shut down...which means the ones they were already employing would now be unemployed.
 
Old 02-21-2014, 08:09 AM
 
3,147 posts, read 3,507,655 times
Reputation: 1873
Quote:
Originally Posted by risotto11 View Post
Not too smart, are we? It's not a cost of living but TOTAL COMPENSATION. You heard this term, haven't you?
To attract talent, employers often offer white collar workers imuch more much than just a monetary reward or salary. and the combined value of all stock options, 401K, GENEROUS MEDICAL, company car AND the monetary award offered by the employer comprises TOTAL COMPENSATION of such employee.

Similarly, $7.50 worker on top of his monetary award gets all the government programs that together comprise his TOTAL COMPENSATION. From food stamps to free school lunches for his kids.


This is why $7.50 doesn't reflect a true value of labor because the government covers the remainder of total compensation, funded by the tax payer in form of government programs.

Got it?
No, YOU don't "got it".

Total compensation is the cost of the labor, taxes, and benefits that an employer pays to hire an employee... if total compensation does not match your cost of living, tough! If your labor was WORTH more, then somebody else would hire you for that amount... if that isn't true, then why aren't ALL jobs minimum wage? Higher wages exist because people compete to hire valuable labor.

Maybe you should look at moving in with roommates or something to lower your COL, but there is no requirement that an employer must pay you enough to live comfortably.

Again, you are doing THE EXACT SAME THING as your last post, and you are completely misusing words, and you have an attitude about it? Total compensation, again, is the total cost to the employer to hire somebody, ie. wages, taxes, and benefits... IT IS NOT the total spent by the employee on their lifestyle.. that is COST OF LIVING.

I would ask you if you "got it" now, but I already know you don't.
 
Old 02-21-2014, 08:15 AM
 
10,785 posts, read 5,718,261 times
Reputation: 10942
Quote:
Originally Posted by risotto11 View Post
End welfare? What you gonna do with hundreds of thousands hungry people? Let them starve on sidewalks? Is this how you picture this country?

All I want is for business to pay the real value of labor they utilize instead of being subsidized by taxpayers.
You keep saying this, and it just isn't true.

Given that government has to mandate a minimum wage, it is clear that isn't the real value of labor. The real value of that labor is LESS than the minimum wage. Business isn't being subsidized in any way, shape, or form.
 
Old 02-21-2014, 08:17 AM
 
804 posts, read 619,986 times
Reputation: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
They are far from starving. We have an obesity problem in the US, not a starvation problem.
There is hunger in the us or more precisely: malnutrition. Remember, I volunteer in a soup kitchen and I see stuff most people living in gated communities don't. Now, you take away food stamps and all other government programs, like you or other poster proposed, and this people, with their families and kids, will go hungry. Is that what you want?
 
Old 02-21-2014, 08:24 AM
 
804 posts, read 619,986 times
Reputation: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xander_Crews View Post
You keep making that claim, but have shown no evidence that the costs of goods are the same.
Again, just for you. The price of gas in NJ is not higher than in Penn, while no mandates full service and penny doesn't. Even though no requires additional labor the cost of gas in NJ and PA is the same.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Xander_Crews View Post
It is a service that people appreciated, and were willing to pay money for. If the service was available today for a low wage, I would pay for it... and there would be people willing to work for that wage. Thank god you stepped in and saved that usher from having a job, god forbid we voluntarily exchange money for service.
If people really wanted ushers some smart business owner would offer this service but no. Nobody cares for ushers in 2014 where people, like myself, routinely by movie tickets on line to avoid standing in line. Wake up, bud. It's XXI century! Lol

Last edited by Ibginnie; 02-21-2014 at 09:09 AM.. Reason: edited quoted post
 
Old 02-21-2014, 08:28 AM
 
804 posts, read 619,986 times
Reputation: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by pnwmdk View Post
Yup.
Have you ever been to Germany or Japan?


Quote:
Originally Posted by pnwmdk View Post
There might. But there's always room to do different and better.
Better? Our infant mortality rate is way behind Germany or Japan. We have plenty of catching up to do before we start being better lol


Man, get out of your basement, trailer park or attic and travel. See the world, learn about the world. Don't rely on media to give you all the answers. It will broaden your horizon. I promise.
 
Old 02-21-2014, 08:28 AM
 
69,368 posts, read 64,204,958 times
Reputation: 9383
Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
Actually college level econ 101 and 102 cover things like this-if you pass them and have a interest. The vast majority who scream the loudest here have never taken either.
What part of college econ 101 and 102 says that you can increase the cost to build / produce / distribute / sell etc a product, but not increase the price to pay for it?

I must have missed that day
 
Old 02-21-2014, 08:32 AM
 
804 posts, read 619,986 times
Reputation: 156
It's the employers responsibility to cover the entire cost of labor they utilize. It's not the government, nor the taxpayer responsibility to pick up the tab for the balance. American employers are not paying the full cost of labor at this time. The government is subsidizing them.



Quote:
Originally Posted by pnwmdk View Post
Logic fail.

It is not the responsibility of an employer to ensure the employee earns what YOU demand he earns. Nor is it the responsibility of the taxpayers to fund your giveaways to meet imaginary "standards".
 
Old 02-21-2014, 08:32 AM
 
3,147 posts, read 3,507,655 times
Reputation: 1873
Quote:
Originally Posted by risotto11 View Post
Again, just for you. The price of gas in NJ is not higher than in Penn, while no mandates full service and penny doesn't. Even though no requires additional labor the cost of gas in NJ and PA is the same.

You fail again, I did not ask for gas prices, I asked for prices of all the goods and services, try again kid.

Quote:
If people really wanted ushers some smart business owner would offer this service but no. Nobody cares for ushers in 2014 where people, like myself, routinely by movie tickets on line to avoid standing in line. Wake up, bud. It's XXI century! Lol
Your silly attitude does not change the fact that minimum wage laws killed that job, and people used that job to step up to better ones. A smart business owner WOULD offer the service, if it didn't cost $7.50/hr to do so.

Because the VALUE OF LABOR is less than $7.50 on that job, kid.

Last edited by Ibginnie; 02-21-2014 at 09:10 AM.. Reason: deleted quoted psot and reply
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