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Do you think Richard Dawkins is being fair? I mean, pedophilia is horrible but do you think we exaggerate how far beyond the pale it is compared to other crimes? It doesn't seem like the abuse Dawkins endured as a child broke his spirit, I think that was the point he was trying to make. A lot of people don't see anything wrong with belting the crap out of your kid when they misbehave yet most of these same people (who generally are small on forgiveness and big on punishment) would want Dawkins' abusers to be publicly lynched.
I personally think what Dawkins said is perfectly reasonable and the only reason people are upset is because due to the current moral panic anyone who doesn't invoke the Holocaust or describe elaborate torture fantasies when the subject of pedophilia comes up is assumed to be one themselves. I've been felt up before and it wasn't fun but it didn't ruin my life so who has the right to tell me it did?
He also pointed out times were different and people didn't even think that much of the subject. In the future today's parents may be seen as monstrous abusers for spanking and circumsizing their kids, both of which like pedophilia are cruel and unnecessary acts of violence. Yet, since they aren't sexual in nature people are generally OK with them or at least not outraged.
I know I'm gonna get a ton of crap for this but I can think of many things that disturb me a lot more than pedophilia. Like genocide, acid attacks, war, school shootings, torture, child labor, medical malpractice. Those things upset/anger me every bit as much as pedophilia if not more. Of course in severe cases like Joseph Fritzl molestation could rise up to this level of atrocity but I think there are different degrees. A lot of molestation is done by other children/teenagers who aren't fully developed mentally and are new to having hormones and I'd imagine most of them do not grow up to be Jeffrey Dahmer and feel a lot of shame about what they did when they were younger. Not to mention many of them are acting out abuse previously inflicted upon them because it's all they know.
The only crime that seems to elicit even close to a similar a response of anger is animal abuse. Nobody really cares that much if a crime is done to an adult human who is not related to them I've noticed. Maybe we're so jaded and unloving a society/species we only care if cute and innocent beings suffer?
While being physically beat up is awful, scars heal. Being molested (I would imagine) is like being stripped of your humanism. It's more mental, which is worse. There also seems to be high levels of it being passed on, as in victims turn into perpetrators. Most people are just never the same it seems. Of the examples you listed, only torture would compare IMO.
What else would you expect from an ungodly man. He's just trying to pave the way to acceptance of another sexual perversion. Its not all that surprising. From what I know, the practice was acceptable in ancient Greece. Just another attempt to break down all God's standards for behavior.
I'm sure that it affects different people in different ways. I don't doubt that you (OP) and Richard D were only mildly affected. However, a close friend of mine was molested at age six by a neighbor, and she's had a lifelong fear of sex because or it. So yes, it can absolutely scar you for life.
What else would you expect from an ungodly man. He's just trying to pave the way to acceptance of another sexual perversion. Its not all that surprising. From what I know, the practice was acceptable in ancient Greece. Just another attempt to break down all God's standards for behavior.
Not a very impressive rebuttal when "godly" men of all Christian denominations have a long history of sexually molesting those they are supposed to be ministering to. And in Ireland, at least, investigations showed that females were not innocent of these acts, and the same is undoubtedly true elsewhere.
It doesn't seem to be a problem at all related to lack of religious belief as far as I can see.
While being physically beat up is awful, scars heal. Being molested (I would imagine) is like being stripped of your humanism. It's more mental, which is worse. There also seems to be high levels of it being passed on, as in victims turn into perpetrators. Most people are just never the same it seems. Of the examples you listed, only torture would compare IMO.
Something that sets sexual molestation apart in a psychological way is the fact that the crotch and the buttocks from a very, very early age are shrouded in mystery by adults, tainted as being parts of the body that should be left alone, and whose products are dirty.
Given this type of cultural training, is it any wonder then that when an adult handles this very taboo part of the child's body - and in the process, sometimes at least - arouses pleasure along with fear that the young victim is psychologically blown out of the water. And if that invasive party is a parent or other trusted adult, rather than a stranger it surely must have even more impact.
Being used by a parent especially undermines all the basic training/lessons in life that have occurred up to that point. What does the child do then? Just how does a child begin again at zero when a primary (presumably) previously trusted parental teacher has torn away an entire complex of rules, taboos, etc. that have been instilled beginning from the earliest months of life? I would suggest that unless there is some therapeutic intervention close to the time that such molestation occurs, that the child will begin navigating like the lone survivor of a shipwreck - with no trusted chart, and I can see this developing into a survivor mentality/pattern that will lead to a maturation process that (IMO) will have entire areas and directions that are not part of what we would usually consider normal in child development.
It says the OP is no longer a member, but he/she did begin an interesting topic, so I'll reply. I can see the point being made, and I'd say it's up to the individual how much they are affected by molestation. I'd say it also depends on how close the relationship beforehand, the extent of the abuse, age it happened, etc, so there is some gray area.
I'm happy some adults don't feel they suffered much long-term hardships from being "felt up" as children, but not everyone is so lucky. I've fostered several toddlers who evidently suffered abuse from their parents, and bath time was always traumatic. A couple of them cried the entire time; one girl went along fine with all the emotions, but as we were set to get in the water, she went to vomit in the toilet (had my wife take care of it from there). So I don't think we can make any broad generalizations about sexual abuse being overstated; violating and breaking the fragile trust of a child is one of the most serious crimes one can undertake. I don't believe in categorizing and competing between horrific acts, but I can't think of much worse than brutal Sandusky-style rape of children.
It says the OP is no longer a member, but he/she did begin an interesting topic, so I'll reply. I can see the point being made, and I'd say it's up to the individual how much they are affected by molestation. I'd say it also depends on how close the relationship beforehand, the extent of the abuse, age it happened, etc, so there is some gray area.
I'm happy some adults don't feel they suffered much long-term hardships from being "felt up" as children, but not everyone is so lucky. I've fostered several toddlers who evidently suffered abuse from their parents, and bath time was always traumatic. A couple of them cried the entire time; one girl went along fine with all the emotions, but as we were set to get in the water, she went to vomit in the toilet (had my wife take care of it from there). So I don't think we can make any broad generalizations about sexual abuse being overstated; violating and breaking the fragile trust of a child is one of the most serious crimes one can undertake. I don't believe in categorizing and competing between horrific acts, but I can't think of much worse than brutal Sandusky-style rape of children.
WHOA. A 1.5 year member with 2,000 posts banned just like that.
I only skimmed through the opening post and didn't click on the link, but yes our society does "exaggerate" when it comes to pedophilia and just about anything sex related (gay sex, sodomy, incest, polygamy).
Also, when people think of pedophilia they tend to think of molestation. Naturally, raping a child should be seen as an abomination, however that isn't necessarily what pedophilia is - but people often get too emotional when discussing touchy subjects like that to realize that.
I'm not sure what he said, but he is brave for saying what he really thinks. Pedophilia is a very touchy subject that can very easily ruin a person's reputation (I'm sure my very post will ruin mine to some degree).
Also, when people think of pedophilia they tend to think of molestation. Naturally, raping a child should be seen as an abomination, however that isn't necessarily what pedophilia is - but people often get too emotional when discussing touchy subjects like that to realize that.
When is pedophilia not molestation? It's certainly not consensual; there's no notion of consent when the adult is over twice your height and twice your age, and simply has authority over you, not to mention that the child isn't emotionally mature enough.
I've heard it suggested that sex with someone aged 14+, maybe 15+, should be a misdemeanor rather than a felony. I might agree with that. The idea that a 20-year-old having sex with a 16-year-old makes them a sex offender for life is simply wrong.
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