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I listened to the interview and hell has frozen over. I mostly agree with him. There seems a disconnect between Ryan's actual words and the sensational headline.
Where I differ:
What incentives are there for a young and able adult man not to work? They are not receiving SNAP, TANF SSDI or lifetime unemployment .
I would like to see every unemployed man in Wisconsin make a pilgrimage to Ryan's office to let him know they are ready to "suck it up and deal with it" and ask him where are the jobs, in his state.
Specifically, which companies have chosen less productive models and relocated jobs from Asia back to the US and/or ignore higher productive technologies in favor of employing more people?
The majority of jobs in the U.S. have historically been no/low skill jobs.
There is a correlation between the welfare state and business choosing more productive manufacturing models and/or technologies.
Schooling is free in this country. If you graduate HS, get married before having a baby and land any full time job you have 2% chance of landing poverty. I'll concede that the last point, landing a full time job is more difficult in some places than others. However the first two points are well within the realm of personal responsibility.
We know only 65% of Blacks graduate high school with a diploma (GED aren't valued by market). We also know 70%+ of black babies are born out of wedlock. These numbers are even worse in the inner city. In light if these numbers wouldn't you say culture while maybe not entirely to blame is a big reason for inner city poverty?
Uh....none of that has anything to do with what I said.
The OP has a link speaking of how Paul Ryan is blaming unemployed black men for poverty due to them having no incentive to get a job.
I stated the truth - women and children are the primary people who are in poverty.
Also, black men cannot get any sort of access to social welfare programs unless they are a veteran or a single father.
But if you want to discuss high school diplomas, I'll go there in that nationally it is true the figures you quote. FWIW, they are WAY higher than they used to be. Before you stated that on these forums via a link you posted some time ago, the last figures I heard was less than 50% of blacks had a typical high school diploma, so 65% is a great improvement.
In regards to GED, I don't get how they "aren't valued by market." What market? Last I saw, one could get a job at McDonald's with a GED. They can work in a warehouse. They can work in a factory. My mom has a GED (she was a teen mom) and she worked for many years in factories, went to school part time and got a 4 year degree, saved enough money and opened her own business. My dad is a high school drop out with no GED and he also has his own business. I have a little brother who got sick of high school, dropped out, and got a GED (he is only in his 20s) and he has a job in a factory making $15 (which is really good money for the area they live in, especially for someone his age). He is married and his wife works as well, she also has a GED and is in school an hour and goes to college as he doesn't want to work in the factory his entire life. A GED is fine for most people who are not seeking some sort of Ivy League education. Most people aren't and even if they are, if they have a great story, I'm sure a top notch school would give them an equal shot at admission. And FWIW, I know a lot of white people with GEDs as well. And someone with a GED has a better shot at getting that warehouse or factory job versus a guy who doesn't. So if they are older and never got a diploma, it is good for them to get the GED as it can be a step forward.
I do feel a culture of poverty is to blame in many areas, not just the inner city. As stated, many statistics on poverty in regards to urban and rural areas have the urban areas on top due to the many programs and ease of transportation, attending school, and support systems in place for inner city people versus those out in the country who don't have as many resources.
But once again. Black men are not benefitting from social welfare programs and in that respect they are not to blame for poverty.
I listened to the interview and hell has frozen over. I mostly agree with him. There seems a disconnect between Ryan's actual words and the sensational headline.
Where I differ:
What incentives are there for a young and able adult man not to work? They are not receiving SNAP, TANF SSDI or lifetime unemployment .
I would like to see every unemployed man in Wisconsin make a pilgrimage to Ryan's office to let him know they are ready to "suck it up and deal with it" and ask him where are the jobs, in his state.
Specifically, which companies have chosen less productive models and relocated jobs from Asia back to the US and/or ignore higher productive technologies in favor of employing more people?
The majority of jobs in the U.S. have historically been no/low skill jobs.
There is a correlation between the welfare state and business choosing more productive manufacturing models and/or technologies.
I thought the OP link was rather surprising in regards to Paul Ryan because as stated, I know that he has been out trying to garner more minority support for the GOP so I was pretty surprised that he would say what he said in the OP link.
I'll look up the interview but your comments still seem to portray the idea that he did in fact state that there are incentives for unemployed men not to work.
Like you, I don't get that.
FWIW, I understand that there are incentives for the single mom not to get married. She will not get her fat tax refund or be eligible for various social programs if she reports her significant others/boyfriend/husband's income. But there is no incentive for the man IMO.
Single moms usually work too and they still get the incentives not to get married. That is a whole other story that Ryan could have spoken on and not focused on inner city people either as this is a trend now-a-days not to get married and just utilize social welfare programs. Men don't get the luxury though and to me it just comes across as another silly attempt to blame the black man for something that he really has no part in.
It was dog whistle politics as usual. Now he has backtracked his remarks calling them inarticulate.
Heres what he first said.
We have got this tailspin of culture, in our inner cities in particular, of men not working and just generations of men not even thinking about working or learning the value and the culture of work, and so there is a real culture problem here that has to be dealt with,” he said, urging everyone to get involved in blighted communities even if they live in the suburbs.
This is what he said today:
“I was not implicating the culture of one community — but of society as a whole,” he said. “We have allowed our society to isolate or quarantine the poor rather than integrate people into our communities. The predictable result has been multi-generational poverty and little opportunity. … The broader point I was trying to make is that we cannot settle for this status quo and that government and families have to do more and rethink our approach to fighting poverty.”
What is your remedy for "improving education"? Throwing more money at it hasn't seemed to work in low performing areas.
IMO, it's got to come from the parents and the leaders in the community. I went to a majority black school and was the only white guy riding the bus. The black males that were studious were severely ridiculed and called names....that mentality has to change.
IMO, it's got to come from the parents and the leaders in the community. I went to a majority black school and was the only white guy riding the bus. The black males that were studious were severely ridiculed and called names....that mentality has to change.
I agree with you in theory, but since the parents and leaders aren't doing this and don't seem to be interested in doing this, what is your remedy? Leave it as is?
I was the studious young Black male dealing with that mindset 20 years ago. People aren't going to change as a group unless something pushes them in that direction.
My solution is vouchers. Get those studious ones a ticket out of there instead of allowing them to be drowned in the system of negativity and anti-intellectualism. Nothing else has a prayer because no politician is going to upset parents (voters), and no "leader" is going to rock the boat either and upset his/her gravy train.
For the rest, either leave them all behind or find people to run for office who are actually going to kick out discipline problems and hold parents accountable. (yeah right)
I agree with you in theory, but since the parents and leaders aren't doing this and don't seem to be interested in doing this, what is your remedy? Leave it as is?
I was the studious young Black male dealing with that mindset 20 years ago. People aren't going to change as a group unless something pushes them in that direction.
My solution is vouchers. Get those studious ones a ticket out of there instead of allowing them to be drowned in the system of negativity and anti-intellectualism. Nothing else has a prayer because no politician is going to upset parents (voters), and no "leader" is going to rock the boat either and upset his/her gravy train.
For the rest, either leave them all behind or find people to run for office who are actually going to kick out discipline problems and hold parents accountable. (yeah right)
Whatever the solution is, its not gonna happen overnight.
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Paul Ryan Now Calls His Remarks Inarticulate
