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Old 04-02-2014, 08:33 PM
 
13,955 posts, read 5,625,642 times
Reputation: 8614

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
None of that is really relevant.

What is relevant is that they cherry-pick their dates, and with good reason.

The will never show you the temperature range for the entire 400,000 year period, due to the fact that the last 8 Inter-Glacial Periods were all warmer than present.

In fact, the average temperature for the last Inter-Glacial Period was 10°F warmer than right now.

Factually....

Mircea
I was just giving a sampling of my hundreds of unanswered questions about the sloppiness of the experimental method in climate science in general, given how much of it depends on extrapolation of wildly inaccurate measurements and historical record. The first claim made is always "unprecedented" and nobody can seem to answer the margin of error question where extrapolating (introduces level of error) from historical records (exponential magnifying existing error) that are incomplete and inaccurate (further exponentiation).

Even the measurement of the global mean temperature in 2014 is sloppy if reducing external influences that skew your data is a goal. A more accurate global mean temperature data collection system would employ thousands of the exact same measuring device, all calibrated and verified by two independent and separate entities, and the collection would be 5 minute intervals across all points across at least a 20-30 year cycle.

But no, we drop a few hundred thermometers in carefully chosen locations to get them just near enough to heat blooms and other locally temperature sensitive locations to get a set of data that more easily fits a preconceived theory, or your already mentioned confirmation bias fallacy with a little begging of the question thrown in.

So much sloppy in the entire thing it defies comprehension how it is taken any more seriously than astrology.

 
Old 04-02-2014, 08:36 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
16,911 posts, read 10,591,580 times
Reputation: 16439
Pretty graphs. I have a question. If CO2 causes the global temperature to rise, and your own graphs show a continued exponential increase in CO2 over the past 17 years, why hasn't the earth warmed in relative proportion to the CO2 increase. I mean, if man-made "green house gasses" really do directly cause an increase in the earth's temperature, then we should always see a proportional increase. So what happened? And don't say the ocean ate the hot air...
 
Old 04-02-2014, 08:38 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
16,911 posts, read 10,591,580 times
Reputation: 16439
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
I was just giving a sampling of my hundreds of unanswered questions about the sloppiness of the experimental method in climate science in general, given how much of it depends on extrapolation of wildly inaccurate measurements and historical record. The first claim made is always "unprecedented" and nobody can seem to answer the margin of error question where extrapolating (introduces level of error) from historical records (exponential magnifying existing error) that are incomplete and inaccurate (further exponentiation).

Even the measurement of the global mean temperature in 2014 is sloppy if reducing external influences that skew your data is a goal. A more accurate global mean temperature data collection system would employ thousands of the exact same measuring device, all calibrated and verified by two independent and separate entities, and the collection would be 5 minute intervals across all points across at least a 20-30 year cycle.

But no, we drop a few hundred thermometers in carefully chosen locations to get them just near enough to heat blooms and other locally temperature sensitive locations to get a set of data that more easily fits a preconceived theory, or your already mentioned confirmation bias fallacy with a little begging of the question thrown in.

So much sloppy in the entire thing it defies comprehension how it is taken any more seriously than astrology.
It's like taking an eight of a second video shot of a soccer game and then predicting the winner.
 
Old 04-02-2014, 10:18 PM
 
Location: Palo Alto
12,149 posts, read 8,418,303 times
Reputation: 4190
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
Of course, but they will never be the same as they were millions of years ago when the planet was still undergoing growing pains, and volcanic eruptions were common.
Silly me. I didn't know.
 
Old 04-02-2014, 10:19 PM
 
Location: Palo Alto
12,149 posts, read 8,418,303 times
Reputation: 4190
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJJersey View Post
It's like taking an eight of a second video shot of a soccer game and then predicting the winner.
Real Madrid. Now shut up and pay your carbon tax like a good little citizen.

:grin:
 
Old 04-02-2014, 10:21 PM
 
25,847 posts, read 16,528,639 times
Reputation: 16025
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
You do realize that conditions on earth were much different in the distant past, don't you? Science does not ignore past climate forcings or conditions.
The dinosaurs used to fart more greenhouse gasses than we produce.
 
Old 04-02-2014, 10:28 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
33,536 posts, read 37,140,220 times
Reputation: 14000
Quote:
Originally Posted by PullMyFinger View Post
The dinosaurs used to fart more greenhouse gasses than we produce.
I'll bet you produce your share, right?
 
Old 04-02-2014, 10:48 PM
 
Location: New Orleans, La. USA
6,354 posts, read 3,654,438 times
Reputation: 2522
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
I love it when graphs show data that could not be measured. The equipment was not invented to test the data, nor was there ever a reason to do the testing.


Explain the drought and dust bowl of the 1950s and 1880's, once people made it past the Mississippi river, to see it and document it.


What has been documented is that our cold/hot, rainy dry cycles every 50-60.
Global warming made the ice age go away. Explain that!
The first graph shows temperatures and CO2 levels from 1880 to 2010.

In 1880 we had accurate thermometers. And scientists used "ice" core samples to get the CO2 levels from 1880.

Carbon dioxide in Earth's atmosphere - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


By using other methods scientists have a rough idea of what CO2 levels were 550 million years ago.

Carbon dioxide in Earth's atmosphere - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




The second graph shows the suns energy output from 1975 to 2005.

"The first satellites designed to observe the Sun were NASA's Pioneers 5, 6, 7, 8 and 9, which were launched between 1959 and 1968." (But I would assume people were measuring the suns output on Earth LONG before 1959.)

Sun - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




The third graph shows CO2 concentrations. My above sources explain how those measurements were taken.
 
Old 04-02-2014, 10:51 PM
 
25,847 posts, read 16,528,639 times
Reputation: 16025
Maybe in 100 more years of study, scientists will better understand the relationship of the Earth and the Sun and the many different forms of energy the Sun puts out and how it affects the core of the Earth, the true source of our temps.

Again, this is hilarious "science".
 
Old 04-02-2014, 11:15 PM
 
Location: New Orleans, La. USA
6,354 posts, read 3,654,438 times
Reputation: 2522
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Nobody was accurately taking temperature measurements in the late 19th early 20th century either. To say it was an average of 57 could be 56-57-58 or even 59. It matters where the temperatures are being taken from also.

Nobody has an actual idea what the exact average temperature was in Russia, China, Africa, Australia etc etc etc to this degree.
In 1612, the Italian inventor Santorio Santorio made the first thermometer (but it was not very accurate.)

"What can be considered the first modern thermometer, the mercury thermometer with a standardized scale, was invented by Daniel Gabriel Fahrenheit in 1714."

The History of the Thermometer


But it appears today's scientists don't "fully" trust thermometer readings until 1880.
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