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Old 04-09-2014, 03:12 PM
 
14,293 posts, read 9,659,141 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
I know, you all looked at the title, and said "I am going to go into this thread and tear into this, this guys wrong. We ALL know the rich pay more!"

But thats because the debate is all about cherry picking data. We look at federal taxes-but exclude social security which is a 6.3%+6.3% tax....paid for by the working poor. But ONLY on the first 112K of income. The average .1%er has it as a rounding error. Heck as a % of my income I paid more in social security then Romney paid in federal....but then again my federal rate was ALSO higher then his....

But wait...what about state taxes? Turns out thats paid at a 5.6% rate by the average .1%er....and 11% for the poor folks.

So all this screaming about the federal rate, conveniently ignores the other taxes. Why is that? hmmmmm

edit-To clarify the title, twice as much as a % of their income.
If you are saying that a person living paycheck to paycheck pays a greater percentage of their income on taxes, I agree. Look at the increased costs for necessities, food, gasoline, electricity, clothing and durable goods, it's the lower income folks who see their paychecks take it in the shorts.


So I'm guessing you'd be in favor of a repealing the 16th amendment, do away with ten of thousands of incomprehensible IRS laws and regulations, and going to a some sort of flat tax?
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:12 PM
 
Location: Central Ohio
10,823 posts, read 14,898,817 times
Reputation: 16537
Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
A fair enough criticism, I could have worded it better. It doesn't change the underlying statement though.

Next
I know, this is from the far, far right wing so called "News Publisher" CNBC but here goes.

The rich do not pay the most taxes, they pay ALL the taxes
Wednesday, 11 Dec 2013 | 11:56 AM ET
CNBC.com

Quote:
Buried inside a Congressional Budget Office report this week was this nugget: when it comes to individual income taxes, the top 40 percent of wage earners in America pay 106 percent of the taxes. The bottom 40 percent...pay negative 9 percent.
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:13 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,321,515 times
Reputation: 27718
Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
If you take a guy who makes 50K, and take 20K from him in taxes, he has to survive off of 30K

If you take a guy who makes 50 million, and take 14 million from him in taxes, he has to survive off of 36 million.

Oh the horror.

We as a nation should never tax that portion of income needed to survive. Thats kind of the point of progressive taxation......

And yet....12.6% in S.S., and 11% in state.......on the income many need to survive.
It's not 12.6% from an employees paycheck..it's 6.3%
And not all states have a state income tax.


One reason low income folks shouldn't live in high COL areas.

NYC has city, state and federal.
Any city in Texas only has federal.

Your choice to live where you live.
I left NYC because of the taxes.

And these "working poor" should adjust their W-4's so that the government doesn't keep their money all year long as a "free loan".
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:14 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,388,296 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michiganmoon View Post
Do you know what percent of households get back more in federal income taxes than they paid in - as in they make a profit off of the tax?

It is not that uncommon to see people make a few thousand dollars in profit off of the federal income taxes with the people that we help do their taxes for.

Do you think this pays for their other taxes on the year and then they have a net total tax calculation of nothing?


P.S. If you paid a higher effective federal income tax rate than Romney, then you are in the top 10 to 20% of worst hit people with taxes - as CNN said that they estimated his effective tax rate was still higher than 80 to 90% of America's.

Parents, parents, parents get almost ALL the tax goodies.
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:14 PM
 
34,274 posts, read 19,312,630 times
Reputation: 17256
Quote:
Originally Posted by michiganmoon View Post
Do you know what percent of households get back more in federal income taxes than they paid in - as in they make a profit off of the tax?

It is not that uncommon to see people make a few thousand dollars in profit off of the federal income taxes with the people that we help do their taxes for.

Do you think this pays for their other taxes on the year and then they have a net total tax calculation of nothing?
I love that talking point. The answer you're looking for is 60%...but it depends on how you frame it.

Does walmart profit from food stamps for their employees and for others? Does GE profit from selling military jet engines, and then pass that on to its CEO's and shareholders?

The answer is-its more complex then that. and how do you define the benefits.
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:15 PM
 
24,834 posts, read 37,276,103 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
Really? you want me to post links on the social security rates? REALLY? You don't believe me?
Nope.

I would like to read creditable links for your entire stance.
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:15 PM
 
34,274 posts, read 19,312,630 times
Reputation: 17256
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
It's not 12.6% from an employees paycheck..it's 6.3%
And not all states have a state income tax.


One reason low income folks shouldn't live in high COL areas.

NYC has city, state and federal.
Any city in Texas only has federal.

Your choice to live where you live.
I left NYC because of the taxes.

And these "working poor" should adjust their W-4's so that the government doesn't keep their money all year long as a "free loan".
6.3% from their paycheck, and ANOTHER 6.3% paid by their employer as part of their compensation. Did you not know that?

PS-its a free loan because guess what? The working poor can't afford to pay their taxes late-if they owe it would be too much of a debt at once to pay without penalty.
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:17 PM
 
24,834 posts, read 37,276,103 times
Reputation: 11538
Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
LOL The gravy train? As a father of 8 I can assure you thats not how I would describe being a parent. 60 hr work weeks followed up by non stop work at home is how I describe it....
What caused all those children??
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:19 PM
 
34,274 posts, read 19,312,630 times
Reputation: 17256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Driller1 View Post
Nope.

I would like to read creditable links for your entire stance.
I'm not your google monkey. Seriously. These are not complex or unreasonable numbers here. I suspect the vast majority can see that. you being unable to means maybe you should educate yourself more.
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:21 PM
 
34,274 posts, read 19,312,630 times
Reputation: 17256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Driller1 View Post
What caused all those children??
What you don't know? (grin)

Twins at age 17. ouch. then 2 more.....a large but doable family.

Then divorce

New wife had 2 kids when I met her. I raised them from wee little ones until a decade later when she left and told friends she couldnt handle that many kids. Her two kids refused to leave with her, so her and their dad paid me child support.

Remarried...new wife has 2 kids....
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