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Why would a Nebraskan's vote hold more weight than a New Yorker's? Sates aren't voting for the president, citizens are. If 51% of California's voters say they want Candidate A then 49% of California's voters votes aren't counted. It is a joke. Flyover states will moan because first run primaries and swing electorates are the only reason anyone would ever want to visit Ohio.
Hmmm... Why did you reference Ohio as flyover country? We're the 7th most populous, with 3 major large metropolitan areas (4 if you count Toledo) and over 11.5 million people. I may be biased, because I live here, but I can think of plenty of reasons to visit and things to do in Ohio. The shores of Lake Erie, and the Islands,the Rock N Roll Hall of Fame, The Pro Football Hall of Fame, Cedar Point, and Kings Island, the 4 casinos in Cleveland, Columbus, Cincinnati, and Toledo, (the 3 C's are experiencing quite vibrant cores and entertainment districts these days and Cleveland has some great dining) Amish Country, the foot hills of the Appalachians in the southeastern corner of the state. In short, if one can't find something to do in my state, they are a lost cause.
When we see conservative governors in key states passing laws that allocate electoral votes by congressional district rather than "winner takes all" (to take advantage of gerrymandering), I expect to see exactly as much outrage from the wingnuts about rigging the Electoral College. Yes, I really do. I also believe in unicorns.
Hmmm... Why did you reference Ohio as flyover country? We're the 7th most populous, with 3 major large metropolitan areas (4 if you count Toledo) and over 11.5 million people. I may be biased, because I live here, but I can think of plenty of reasons to visit and things to do in Ohio. The shores of Lake Erie, and the Islands,the Rock N Roll Hall of Fame, The Pro Football Hall of Fame, Cedar Point, and Kings Island, the 4 casinos in Cleveland, Columbus, Cincinnati, and Toledo, (the 3 C's are experiencing quite vibrant cores and entertainment districts these days and Cleveland has some great dining) Amish Country, the foot hills of the Appalachians in the southeastern corner of the state. In short, if one can't find something to do in my state, they are a lost cause.
I'm Texan and the second you put chili on spaghetti you are on my hit list.
Why would a Nebraskan's vote hold more weight than a New Yorker's? Sates aren't voting for the president, citizens are. If 51% of California's voters say they want Candidate A then 49% of California's voters votes aren't counted. It is a joke. Flyover states will moan because first run primaries and swing electorates are the only reason anyone would ever want to visit Ohio.
Yes, please explain why my vote as a New Yorker should count less than votes in those swing states? I imagine if we decide the president by popular vote, voter turnout would improve dramatically.
Why would a Nebraskan's vote hold more weight than a New Yorker's? Sates aren't voting for the president, citizens are. If 51% of California's voters say they want Candidate A then 49% of California's voters votes aren't counted. It is a joke. Flyover states will moan because first run primaries and swing electorates are the only reason anyone would ever want to visit Ohio.
Actually, the reverse is true. A New Yorker's currently holds more weight than a Nebraskan's, because democracies invariably favor more urban parts of the population.
As for your 51% anecdote, you might want to consider this. If 70% of New Yorkers vote for a Democrat, but the nation votes for a Republican, then the law Cuomo just signed means that the 70% of New Yorkers don't get counted, because it won't matter how New Yorkers vote at all.
The United States in not a democracy. It was never meant to be a democracy. The founding father (not incorrectly) did not really trust the populace, and wanted some "adults" in the loop to prevent the voters from doing anything too stupid (okay, that plan has failed miserably.)
You have to realize what the constitution is. It's a deal between what were a bunch of semi-independent nation-states to form a strong central government. However the smaller ones were afraid of getting run over by the bigger ones, and they were all afraid of having their authority usurped by the central government they were forming. All this colors the deal they made, which we're still bound by. What the voters might want was only a minor consideration.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Mon
So the "Freedom loving Real Americans" have a disdain for actual democracy. Well I for one am shocked! Shocked I tell you.
The Senate is where representation of rural states is addressed. There's absolutely zero reason no good reason why you wouldn't have direct elections for President. That is unless you believe your chosen candidate can only win on a state by state basis when fewer people vote. And look on the bright side, we'll no longer have to see television pundits lighting up states or carrying around dry erase boards on election night.
Actually, the reverse is true. A New Yorker's currently holds more weight than a Nebraskan's, because democracies invariably favor more urban parts of the population.
As for your 51% anecdote, you might want to consider this. If 70% of New Yorkers vote for a Democrat, but the nation votes for a Republican, then the law Cuomo just signed means that the 70% of New Yorkers don't get counted, because it won't matter how New Yorkers vote at all.
Democracies favor areas with higher population. Go figure.
Also, who cares about that anecdote? I want the person with more votes to win. Just obliterate the electoral college and the problem will be solved. If every state did what the other 10 did we'd have a solution.
Democracies favor areas with higher population. Go figure.
Also, who cares about that anecdote? I want the person with more votes to win. Just obliterate the electoral college and the problem will be solved. If every state did what the other 10 did we'd have a solution.
I want the wisdom of the Founding Fathers to win. They decided we shouldn't be a democracy, because they were educated and aware that democracies were dictatorships of the majority. And that can be dangerous. Especially if you aren't in the majority. Like, say, you live in rural America. Oddly enough, a fundamental principle of our government is to protect the voice of the minority.
Democracies favor areas with higher population. Go figure.
Except they don't:
New York has about 19 million people and 29 electoral votes. If every person in New York could vote, that would mean that each electoral vote would represent 655,000 people.
Kansas has 2.8 million people and 6 electoral votes. That means each electoral vote in Kansas represents 467,000 people.
Wyoming has 576,000 people and 3 electoral votes. That means each electoral vote represents 192,000 people.
These numbers aren't exact because I'm using total population and not eligible voters, but you get the idea. Each voter in Wyoming influences the final result much more than each voter in New York, for no particular reason except the fact that the US was founded in the 18th century.
Wisdom had nothing to do with it. The Electoral College is a remnant of the fact that we were a huge country and there was nothing like modern transportation or communication technology. It would have been technologically infeasible to count every popular vote in a reasonable amount of time. It is feasible today. The only reason anyone is opposed to having a strict popular vote is because one of our two major parties has lost the popular vote in five out of the last six elections. Without gerrymandering and the Electoral College, the Republican Party would be completely powerless.
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