3 weeks until oral arguments are heard agains ACA

[ContrarianEcon]

Originally Posted by mkpunk

Ah. Then it shouldn't be like Obamacare that kicked the decision to the state(local/provincial) governments or else it would be likely similar.

On a side, the US should look to call states provinces as well to not confuse people between state being a provinces and state being countries like in the worldwide prospective.

The way the constitution of the US is written most things have to be done on an individual state level. It would take a constitutional amendment to get real federally sponsored health care the way I think it should be done. But set up a state system side by side with the old one. Cheep crapy health care for those that can't or wont pay. What we have is making people buy insurance from insurance companies. It sucks.

[pghquest]

Originally Posted by jojajn

That is excellent! Way to go Obama!

I'm always tickled when people get all excited by the government growing revenues by $1T and then claiming there is no additional revenues, while at the same time suggesting millions will obtain insurance, while ignoring that 30 million will go without insurance.

You do understand that the reason the tax revenues are so high is because people WONT be insured, right?

ooh it doesnt matter, you'll high 5 him regardless.. its histerical...

[rbohm]

Originally Posted by mkpunk

Then what is it. It seems like one because no matter if it is kept or repealed, people will hurt from either action. It's just who hurts.

we can repeal obamacare, even now, without hurting anyone, in fact it can make things better. but what needs to happen is that any law that replaces obamacare needs to;

1: make it easy for everyone to get health insurance

2: eliminate the ability of the insurance companies to deny coverage for people with preexisting conditions

3: set up a true free market for insurance

4: address the reasons for rising costs in health care, all of them regardless of how small they may seem to be on the surface

5: eliminate health insurance networks, it needs to be completely portable so that you dont have to worry if you are on vacation in florida that your insurance in idaho may not cover any needed health care

thats all i can think of right now i am sure others will pipe in on this.

Besides the insurance companies who exactly loses through single payer healthcare?

actually everyone loses if we go to single payer. why? because there is no incentive for government to control costs. they would look at rising health care costs, and then raise taxes to cover the losses.

Originally Posted by ContrarianEcon

The investors in the said companies? for starters.

why did we need reform any way?

we need health care reform, and health insurance reform, because while we have teh best health care system in the world, there is no control on costs. and with health insurance, everyone wants to sell healthy people a policy, but get sick and hit some arbitrary limit, or lose your insurance through your job for what ever reason and then have lots of issues trying to get a new policy.

Originally Posted by ContrarianEcon

When I said state sponsored I was talking Federal government. As in State sponsored health care in England, France The US of A etc.

no, lets keep the federal government as far away from health care as is possible. in reality the feds hsould not be anywhere near health care anyway as it is intrastate, not interstate business.

[ContrarianEcon]

Originally Posted by rbohm

we need health care reform, and health insurance reform, because while we have teh best health care system in the world, there is no control on costs. and with health insurance, everyone wants to sell healthy people a policy, but get sick and hit some arbitrary limit, or lose your insurance through your job for what ever reason and then have lots of issues trying to get a new policy.

Back in the day everyone most people any way worked at one place from when they started working until they retired. Then came RR. Now people are expected to switch jobs and we need to have our own retirement health care etc. Privet insurance for one person is very expensive. What I would like to see is keep the old system that built what we have and put in a public floor that people that fall through the cracks land on.

Also there are some other structural things wrong with our economy that need to be fixed. We have way too much debt for instance. Wages on the top are pulling away from the bottom. And so on. There needs to be a systematic approach to fixing the whole thing.

Originally Posted by rbohm

no, lets keep the federal government as far away from health care as is possible. in reality the feds hsould not be anywhere near health care anyway as it is intrastate, not interstate business.

I'm all for states rights and all that Jazz but...

Ok that was my original argument just abolish Obama care and let things fall out where they may.

Or we have a government sponsored system that doesn't replace what is there, just runs parallel to it. And that is federal government. If we want to keep states rights then we need to get organized and do it.

[mkpunk]

Originally Posted by rbohm

we can repeal obamacare, even now, without hurting anyone, in fact it can make things better. but what needs to happen is that any law that replaces obamacare needs to;

1: make it easy for everyone to get health insurance

2: eliminate the ability of the insurance companies to deny coverage for people with preexisting conditions

3: set up a true free market for insurance

4: address the reasons for rising costs in health care, all of them regardless of how small they may seem to be on the surface

5: eliminate health insurance networks, it needs to be completely portable so that you dont have to worry if you are on vacation in florida that your insurance in idaho may not cover any needed health care

thats all i can think of right now i am sure others will pipe in on this.

Isn't one, two, five and even four kind of contradictory to three? A free market means that insurance companies can do what they want to do, they would want you to be able to get people with preexisting conditions on their plans because they would eat into profit. Networks would spend some of their money and eat into profit.

Originally Posted by rbohm

actually everyone loses if we go to single payer. why? because there is no incentive for government to control costs. they would look at rising health care costs, and then raise taxes to cover the losses.

You may have to raise taxes to cover costs but costs would be maintained because outside of doctors and medical companies, there's no real incentive to raise prices to increase costs to the healthcare system.