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Old 04-22-2014, 02:52 PM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,198,461 times
Reputation: 18824

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Have a nice war folks!

Me? I'll be here in Arizona relaxing on my patio and sipping Riesling... I'd appreciate it if you'd just move on past my house please.

Thanks.

 
Old 04-22-2014, 02:52 PM
 
13,511 posts, read 17,036,232 times
Reputation: 9691
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quaker15 View Post
I think the H1B program should be expanded and allow more educated, hardworking, and productive people into this country, thus creating more wealthy, tax revenue, etc. I like that!
..so that kids coming out of college with $200K loan balances can't get an entry level job because a company is paying someone from India $12 an hour, which they told them was a lot of money in the the US!!! Then they get here and they are poor, and the college kid has no job.

Great policy idea!!!
 
Old 04-22-2014, 02:54 PM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,740,494 times
Reputation: 9325
Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
..so that kids coming out of college with $200K loan balances can't get an entry level job because a company is paying someone from India $12 an hour, which they told them was a lot of money in the the US!!! Then they get here and they are poor, and the college kid has no job.

Great policy idea!!!
Any kid who has a $200k loan and can't get a job is an idiot.
 
Old 04-22-2014, 02:55 PM
 
3,792 posts, read 2,385,439 times
Reputation: 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
Ronald Reagan taught them that greed was patriotic.
Na he sold us on the biggest debt bubble in the history of the world. So les us print more money than ever in the history of the world. Ooops that would be QE III & IV to late we are already going there.
 
Old 04-22-2014, 02:56 PM
 
13,511 posts, read 17,036,232 times
Reputation: 9691
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Any kid who has a $200k loan and can't get a job is an idiot.
It's a rhetorical device, genius.

You don't have a shortage of skilled workers in the vast majority of fields in the US...what you have is a shortage of companies who want to PAY ANYTHING.
 
Old 04-22-2014, 02:57 PM
 
13,955 posts, read 5,625,642 times
Reputation: 8613
Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
Add a third who completely inserts their agenda.

The OP is talking about OLIGARCHY, not welfare queens stealing your tax money.

Holy smokes.
The OP is talking about a civil war caused by a corrupt oligarchy. I get it. I was expounding on how it would unfold on the ground.

The welfare state I speak of is the creation of corrupt oligarchy, not just here and now, but always and everywhere throughout history. In Ancient Rome, it was called panem et circenses. Read the economic history of the Five Good Emperors ffs.

The corrupt oligarchy buys the loyalty of the masses with the welfare state. It's a part of the historical cycle of all empires. At some point, a political aristocracy forms and they buy loyalty with the fruits of the labor of a minority population. Then use bread and circuses as distractions.

Now, the inevitable thing is the collapse of the system under its own weight. That's where this nonsense created by the oligarchs will begin to follow the path I described earlier.

So enough with your constant bleating that nobody understands the point. And fwiw, just killing/neutering the oligarchs isn't going to fix it. Just ask the Reign of Terror that immediately followed the purging of the aristocracy at the outset of the French Revolution. What happens is the masses see anyone with more than them as part of the oligarchy, thus target for "aggressive wealth redistribution in the name of justice." It's inevitable, and a few billionaires turned into paupers won't satisfy the mob.
 
Old 04-22-2014, 02:58 PM
 
3,978 posts, read 4,577,283 times
Reputation: 2243
Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
..so that kids coming out of college with $200K loan balances can't get an entry level job because a company is paying someone from India $12 an hour, which they told them was a lot of money in the the US!!! Then they get here and they are poor, and the college kid has no job.

Great policy idea!!!
Simple fix! Enforce fair wages law. Done!

That kid with a college degree and $200K student loan who can't get a job = idiot!

Every state has at least two state schools with cheap tuition and some states have over 10 of those.
 
Old 04-22-2014, 02:59 PM
 
Location: A great city, by a Great Lake!
15,896 posts, read 11,988,465 times
Reputation: 7502
Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
The libertarian position I've seen, and maybe this isn't ALL Libertarians, is that if you have no welfare state and open borders, the immigration and unemployment issue will naturally work itself out.

Even with libertarianism not everything is black and white. In regards to welfare, realistically we couldn't just cut it off, as there would be riots in the streets. However; steps do need to be taken to seriously reform the program to get those other than the sick, and elderly (those who truly need it) off of it, and stop enabling the abuse by actually encouraging those to keep pumping out kids for benefits. If we do not get a lid on it, we WILL go broke, and there WILL be riots in the streets.

As for your comment on open borders, the solution is to cut off the freebies that keeps the illegals coming here, and come down on companies that hire them under the table. Cut off the freebies, and they lose incentive to come here, and it may actually give them the incentive to take part in fixing the woes in their own country.

I think that's an incredibly naive and destructive position and would bring our institutions to their knees in about 5 years.

See above. We will go broke if we do not stop the entitlements. That goes for corporate welfare, and too big to fail, as well as funding the Military Industrial Complex, and the wasteful failure that is the war on drugs. We also should not be subsidizing Walmart for example because they pay low wages therefore allowing for their employees to apply for entitlements.

I also support social safety nets, so hard core Libertarian ideology doesn't work for me.

For those who truly need it, like the sick, elderly, mentally challenged, as well as handicaps, I have no issue offering assistance. For those who are able bodied but too damn lazy to work, and continue to make irresponsible decisions like having multiple babies from multiple fathers? Nope. If anything it should be a temporary thing. The way it is set up now only enables those to have more kids, and stay on the system. Maybe it wasn't meant that way, but that is what is happening. In short, I believe in a hand up, not a hand out.

I do think that our government should be concerned about ALL of it's citizens first before anyone else, not Mexicans, and not just big business. I support a benevolent policy towards Mexican citizens..ie encouraging the Mexican government to move into the 21st century, not acting as a pressure relief valve for their poor. This country does not need anymore unskilled workers..it needs less and the governments policy should reflect that, not the reverse.

I agree, which is why I don't vote for either of the main parties. They continue to pander to the elitists and the banksters. Those who have the money make the rules. That is not what is the definition of a free country. The government works for us! ALL of the American people and not the other way around! Cutting those freebies off to illegals would go a long way in reducing illegal immigration. Will our politicians do it? Nope. Because there is no incentive to do so, when both main parties have a lock. Stop voting for these a-holes on both sides of the aisle for once!

If the country actually NEEDS skilled workers, I support the government allowing that too. But I have first hand experience with this...H1bs are used to pay skilled workers less than citizens in the vast majority of situations, and that practice needs to be stopped immediatley.

I look at it this way. If you have no plans of becoming a citizen here, other than of course to visit then you don't need to be here. Why live here, if you're NOT going to become a citizen, and assimilate into our culture as our ancestors have done?
 
Old 04-22-2014, 03:01 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,001 posts, read 35,180,801 times
Reputation: 7875
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChestRockwell View Post
May I glean some of your reasoning?
Because the people who keep calling for a civil war will never actually start one.
 
Old 04-22-2014, 03:09 PM
 
3,792 posts, read 2,385,439 times
Reputation: 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
Because the people who keep calling for a civil war will never actually start one.
we are just not fed up enough and it wouldn't be civil war it would be revolutionary war.
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