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No, you were not being creepy. You were trying to lighten up a tense situation with humor. Can you not see the difference? The difference was clear in your intentions. You knew that you were not hitting on her and I'm sure she knew it too. She knew that you knew that she was frustrated and she also knew that you knew why she was frustrated. I'm sure she also knew that you were trying to cut the tension by adding some humor. People are pretty good at reading others. Like I said in my post that you responded to, there is a huge difference between a man demanding a women's attention with honks, jeers, whistles and a man who is just being friendly, saying hello, smiling, chatting, joking, etc. I'd consider your comments to her to be in the good intention category. I'm sure you could read her as well and would have backed off if you felt like you were just adding to her anger and frustration. Right?
Oh yes! I think I would have been able to tell if my attempt was going to be tossing kerosene on a grease fire.I do get the whole thing about telling a woman to smile just out of the blue with no situational prompting.
(Sigh) Its not my intention to defend that, Its just that I guess the whole concept of engaging a woman is such a manner as to be construed as a "creep" is alien to me. I'm fairly outgoing, have no problem with lighthearted banter with strangers and when engaging in such banter with a woman I do not know, I don't cross lines. I'm not a prowling tomcat though. I figure , that being the case, I need not worry so much about being misinterpreted.
Oh yes! I think I would have been able to tell if my attempt was going to be tossing kerosene on a grease fire.I do get the whole thing about telling a woman to smile just out of the blue with no situational prompting.
(Sigh) Its not my intention to defend that, Its just that I guess the whole concept of engaging a woman is such a manner as to be construed as a "creep" is alien to me. I'm fairly outgoing, have no problem with lighthearted banter with strangers and when engaging in such banter with a woman I do not know, I don't cross lines. I'm not a prowling tomcat though. I figure , that being the case, I need not worry so much about being misinterpreted.
You sound like a nice guy, definitely not in the creepy category. You sound self aware and respectful of boundaries. Those are really good qualities. The type of guy who women will feel harassed by don't heed boundaries. If they are self aware, they don't care if they make a woman feel uncomfortable, in fact that might be their goal. I am sure this probably sounds like a fine line but really the difference between your behavior and the creepy guys' behavior is HUGE.
You sound like a nice guy, definitely not in the creepy category. You sound self aware and respectful of boundaries. Those are really good qualities. The type of guy who women will feel harassed by don't heed boundaries. If they are self aware, they don't care if they make a woman feel uncomfortable, in fact that might be their goal. I am sure this probably sounds like a fine line but really the difference between your behavior and the creepy guys' behavior is HUGE.
Well...I sure hope there's a huge difference. Lmao. And yes...I respect boundaries. Even with my intimate partner there are boundaries. For her AND me. My lady was hurt in a car accident a long time ago and her brain does not process things like most people. Context and tone are VERY important when joking around with her and even then one must be careful to read her and watch for misunderstanding.
She was also assaulted once, a bad deal, and I don't tease in a sexual manner at all To her, sexual innuendo just ain't funny. This is another goodreason ,I suppose, that the type of approach being discussed here is a bad idea. Acting like a baboon on a testosterone high without knowing a ladies history is playing baseball with nitro.
One of her male co workers got handsy with her here not to long back and hes lucky to be alive. Thought seriously about stomping a mud hole in him myself. He undid a LOT of hard work and progress made through pain.
So, upon reflection, I must say, guys, don't be a "creep".
So what's the appropriate way for a stranger to flirt with a woman he has romantic interest in?
Years ago, when I was young and good-looking, I heard the best line from a guy.
I had stopped at a small convenience store on my way to work in the morning. I had noticed a guy pull up in the parking lot just after I had.
He came into the store and milled around a little; I made my purchase and was heading out the door. He came running after me and said (with a big smile!):
"Hey, I'd like to meet you!"
I was very attracted to him, but was in a relationship with someone at the time.
Sigh...I often wonder how my life would have been different if we had gotten together!
So all women feel that way? Or just these vocal ones? Seriously THIS is the most important thing to focus on? I must have missed how truly denigrating comments, catcalls, and much much more have suddenly disappeared. Things have improved immensely then.
Look im not going to continue this. Every person male and female should smile more. Its good for you and others. Even science says so. If I've offended you by that statement that says more about you then me.
Please don't continue this.
PEOPLE (men and women) have boundaries. While being ordered to "Smile!" barely pushes at the boundary, it does push at it. And women, much more than men, are approached by strangers who feel it is appropriate to make personal remarks about their appearance. I think it was you who said earlier in the thread that you didn't do this to strangers, because you don't care. But then you defend people doing this to strangers? The thing is, they ARE strangers. So personal remarks to strangers are ALWAYS in an iffy territory, because they violate a boundary. You don't KNOW a person, so assertions about them, their appearance, their demeanor, their expressions are going to garner an unpredictable response. Even complimentary comments can garner an unpredictable response. But comments that are criticisms? Just inappropriate in general.
And for women, who are socially trained to avoid confrontations, and who physically may feel intimidated in a situation where they are being accosted, when someone is inappropriate with them, may be uncomfortable pointing that out.
While you may think that, "Smile!" is just a casual remark, the truth is that sometimes it's not casual at all. Women who have been harassed know that sometimes it's not casual at all. They know that their reaction has to be gauged to the situation, to try to avoid it becoming a situation. Should they smile back? Or will that be taken as an invitation? Should they just ignore the comment? Or will that be taken as an insult? Should they make a snide remark back, or will that be taken as a provocation?
All of us, every day, have to navigate our way through social interactions where we don't know what the other person is expecting of us, or whether that other person has an agenda. In the case of strangers, those interactions are much more unpredictable. For men, the unpredictability rarely is threatening. For women, that unpredictability can be threatening.
I once had a job which I had to walk to each morning. Which was fine, until a man offered me a ride one morning. I refused. He started following me. The next day, he showed up again. And the next day and the next day. Each day, he offered me a ride. Then he propositioned me. I refused, again and again and again. He started showing up earlier, and earlier along my route. He wanted to know where I lived. He started showing up along my route in the morning. Trying to figure out where I was headed. I had to walk down other streets and cut through people's backyards to try to evade him. He began to offer me money to have sex with him. After several weeks, I brought it up with my coworkers. From my description, one of the coworkers knew who this guy was, that he had a history of harassing women. And she called his employer and got him to stop.
My point is, a woman doesn't know from her first interaction with a stranger whether he is a threat or not. But that is something that always has to be in the back of her mind.
My point is, a woman doesn't know from her first interaction with a stranger whether he is a threat or not. But that is something that always has to be in the back of her mind.
Im sorry you had a bad interaction with a man, but to then tarnish all of us with the same brush?
Brooklyn artists starts campaign to stop "street harassment". Do you think telling women to smile is harassment?
From a stranger yes. I never heard such thing, I guess it's a NYC thing. If the command comes from someone you know I think it would be innappropiate Ex: "OMG you look so nice when you smile, You should do it more often". Yuck.
I think some women though enjoy that attention and respond to those comments, so that's what motivates some men to say such things.
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